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Old 7th May 2019, 1:26 pm   #881
ColinTheAmpMan1
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

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Originally Posted by tritone View Post
Well here's one for you,
There are people out there that will tell you the different sound of different brand 9v batteries when used to power electric guitar effects pedals, seriously !
I think that might be Eric Johnson. He's a great guitarist, but he does have some peculiar little ideas at times.

Colin.
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Old 7th May 2019, 1:34 pm   #882
G4YVM David
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Is it not just possible that cells of lower capacity allow the voltage to be pulled down, resulting in a different sound? Being a musician he might hear something. PP3's never state their capacity and my understanding is that makes will adjust them to the market
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Old 7th May 2019, 1:52 pm   #883
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

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Originally Posted by G4YVM David View Post
Is it not just possible that cells of lower capacity allow the voltage to be pulled down, resulting in a different sound? Being a musician he might hear something. Pp3s never state their capacity and my understanding is that makes will adjust them to the market
Indeed. Yes, Eric Johnson does have some quirks, but he is known to have amazingly good ears too. So, if he says he can hear the difference between two batteries, for the reasons you suggest, there may be some truth in it. One thing to remember is, guitarist footpedals generally (not all of them) run off one PP3 battery. Sometimes the signal levels associated with powerful pickups and signal boosters etc don't leave a lot of headroom when a single rail is used to power an IC. So, maybe that's where a reduced supply voltage may expose itself to someone with very sensitive ears.
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Old 7th May 2019, 2:35 pm   #884
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

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The average weekly wage of a premiership footballer passed £50,000 a couple of years ago https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42130297. 3 days pay for something that might make you happy isn't all that much to ask, I suppose. And they might negotiate a discount too.

The fact is, Craig, that you and I are not the target market .

Cheers,

GJ
That is true alas. The only time I have seen a Bugatti Veyron was in Manchester a few years ago (on our way to see Roger Waters perform The Wall). We guessed that the 1 million quid 1000HP car was probably been driven by a 20 year old Manchester United/City footballer.
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Old 7th May 2019, 3:27 pm   #885
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Or how about a BNC cable for £2,000

https://shunyata-uk.com/product/digi...igma-clock-50/
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Old 7th May 2019, 3:32 pm   #886
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Capacity used to be stated in catalogues for the professional customers. The 1991 Duracell catalogue gives the capacity of the alkaline PP3 equivalent (MN1604) as 550 mAh: the 1985 Vidor catalogue gives their version as 500 mAh.
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Old 7th May 2019, 6:27 pm   #887
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

I wonder if the internal impedance (which may not be purely resistive) has more of an effect than the capacity for PP3s powering effects pedals.
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Old 7th May 2019, 8:01 pm   #888
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

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Or how about a BNC cable for £2,000

https://shunyata-uk.com/product/digi...igma-clock-50/
Well that made me swear rather loudly.

A decent 1.5m long triax with belden 9222 between it is only just over 100 quid.

I'm wondering if these companies are liable for lying.
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Old 7th May 2019, 8:13 pm   #889
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

RW's post #854 to my mind sums up all of this, in as much that whatever the consumer purchases it never is quite good enough unless they purchase the next upgrade.

My best ever system has been made up from a written off amp, early CD player and a modern pair of floorstanding speakers. If I listened carefully when I sat slightly forward of my normal sitting position the so called sound stage was much clearer. I thought this was down to my speakers... No. Recently I was lucky enough to connect up a pair of Shahinion Hawk omnidirectionals to the same system. These are a very, very expensive pair of speakers. And guess what, the sound stage effect is exactly the same! The problem is with my rooms acoustics and not the speakers. The Hawks new now cost around £16K, my own speakers around £400. Relatively little is said in the audio press about room acoustics. I dare say many people may upgrade for acoustics problems rather than any real flaw in their equipment.

What I'm trying to say is that ordinary High street Hi-Fi is now pretty good. So all the press seems to do is to almost make people feel unsettled with their own kit and then sell an 'upgrade'. Good for sales no doubt, if the industry relied on the likes of us engineers, it would soon be game over for the audio industry for good. SJM.
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Old 7th May 2019, 8:34 pm   #890
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

It would be far better to invest a small sum of money on room treatments from this outfit

https://gikacoustics.co.uk/

I was going to go this route until SWMBO gave the idea a solid no-go.

Craig
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Old 8th May 2019, 1:28 am   #891
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ColinTheAmpMan1 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by tritone View Post
Well here's one for you,
There are people out there that will tell you the different sound of different brand 9v batteries when used to power electric guitar effects pedals, seriously !
I think that might be Eric Johnson. He's a great guitarist, but he does have some peculiar little ideas at times.

Colin.
Quote:
Originally Posted by G4YVM David View Post
Is it not just possible that cells of lower capacity allow the voltage to be pulled down, resulting in a different sound? Being a musician he might hear something. PP3's never state their capacity and my understanding is that makes will adjust them to the market
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehertz View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by G4YVM David View Post
Is it not just possible that cells of lower capacity allow the voltage to be pulled down, resulting in a different sound? Being a musician he might hear something. Pp3s never state their capacity and my understanding is that makes will adjust them to the market
Indeed. Yes, Eric Johnson does have some quirks, but he is known to have amazingly good ears too. So, if he says he can hear the difference between two batteries, for the reasons you suggest, there may be some truth in it. One thing to remember is, guitarist footpedals generally (not all of them) run off one PP3 battery. Sometimes the signal levels associated with powerful pickups and signal boosters etc don't leave a lot of headroom when a single rail is used to power an IC. So, maybe that's where a reduced supply voltage may expose itself to someone with very sensitive ears.

Yea, Eric Johnson, thats the guy. He must have excellent hearing to notice what has been mentioned above, so audiophoolery in this case must take a step to one side.
I thought that the idea of different sounding batteries was way over the top but now I can see some logic in the matter. An electronic measurement with something like a signal generator and spectrum analyiser or Oscope could produce some interesting results possibly.
Would one dare to possibly say that the internal composition of one manafactures battery could affect the tone/timbre differently when compared to a different brand battery, considering the different elements and chemicals used ?

Last edited by tritone; 8th May 2019 at 1:33 am.
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Old 8th May 2019, 1:42 am   #892
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Sawyers View Post
It would be far better to invest a small sum of money on room treatments from this outfit

https://gikacoustics.co.uk/

I was going to go this route until SWMBO gave the idea a solid no-go.

Craig
I will give you ONE million bass traps for free!! and it IS an upgrade

( sounds like one of those adds on TV for the " Miracle Vegie Slicer" )

Remove the $1000 dollar 4 uF PIO coupling capacitors and fit 50 pF ceramics instead!! I bet I trap MORE bass than those bass traps.

Well, Craig, you sort of invited that. But I agree, although an audiophool I be,
I don't get conned easily. I did finally service my Garrard 401 this morning.
Cost?? 20 cents worth of acrylic paint thinners for cleaning, and 4 drops of sewing machine oil.
I had really forgotten how quiet a half decent 401 could really sound, or NOT sound as the case may be.

In fun
Joe
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Old 8th May 2019, 7:12 am   #893
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

I see it as a sign that the decoupling on the supply rail can't be very good.

Batteries change characteristics over their operating life, internal resistance goes up and voltage starts to fall. These things need to be accommodated.

David
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Old 8th May 2019, 8:38 am   #894
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Since this thread, I've wondered if I replace the woven mains lead on my 1930's 'woodie' for some exotic, directional, very expensive mains cable ... would this improve the timbre(?)

It'll save me re-veneering!

£2K for a BNC lead though, goodness Mr Bungle indeed

Mark
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Old 8th May 2019, 9:15 am   #895
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Sawyers View Post
Or how about a BNC cable for £2,000

https://shunyata-uk.com/product/digi...igma-clock-50/
Did a little research into the man behind Shunyata and came across this article which really brightened a dull wet start to the day:

https://6moons.com/industryfeatures/caelin/caelin.html

On an even more optimistic note I'm now convinced about the existence of at least one parallel universe.

Alan
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Old 8th May 2019, 9:19 am   #896
Craig Sawyers
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

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Originally Posted by joebog1 View Post
I don't get conned easily. I did finally service my Garrard 401 this morning.
Cost?? 20 cents worth of acrylic paint thinners for cleaning, and 4 drops of sewing machine oil.
I had really forgotten how quiet a half decent 401 could really sound, or NOT sound as the case may be.

In fun
Joe
I don't need to clean my 401 (although I do periodically lubricate it). I bought a custom cover, in the highest quality option, from https://www.digitaldeckcovers.com/ to go over my deck/arm/plinth.

Cost USD60 including shipment to the UK. A bolted on bargain.

RFQ form is here https://www.digitaldeckcovers.com/request-for-estimate .

Craig
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Old 8th May 2019, 10:24 am   #897
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Hello,

£2K BNC lead....

Aggh...... I’ve had to get complete electronic hi-fi products to market (that’s retail + VAT etc.) for a fifth of that price. Anyone who knows typical profit margins, dealer mark-up, UK manufacturing costs and other ‘design’ costs like compliance testing etc., etc. there isn't an awful lot left for the actual parts!

Terry

Last edited by Valvepower; 8th May 2019 at 10:30 am. Reason: Triping errot
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Old 8th May 2019, 10:28 am   #898
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

That Caelin article....

Whoo-Hoo!

"Where the copper is mined is often more important than the absolute purity"

You learn something new every day.

Let's see... 29 protons, 34 or 35 neutrons, with 29 electrons playing in a 2,8,18,1 formation which leads to a propensity for substituting players with other teams.

Maybe the difference lies in the isotope content? Or are there new aspects to quarks... strangeness and charm get a new colleague, we could call it smugness? Up and down get joined by sideways? There has to be something new to carry the differentiation which has been discovered. Do we rip out all the existing gear from the tunnel at CERN and build a ring of very expensive speaker wire for the next step in understanding matter and energy?

David

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Old 8th May 2019, 10:51 am   #899
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

Hello,

Ah, an imbedded Hawkwind LP reference – Quark, Strangeness and Charm

The Space Ritual LP through a Quad II system always hit the spot for me

Terry
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Old 8th May 2019, 10:56 am   #900
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Default Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.

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That Caelin article....

Whoo-Hoo!

"Where the copper is mined is often more important than the absolute purity"

You learn something new every day.

Let's see... 29 protons, 34 or 35 neutrons, with 29 electrons playing in a 2,8,18,1 formation which leads to a propensity for substituting players with other teams.

Maybe the difference lies in the isotope content? Or are there new aspects to quarks... strangeness and charm get a new colleague, we could call it smugness? Up and down get joined by sideways? There has to be something new to carry the differentiation which has been discovered. Do we rip out all the existing gear from the tunnel at CERN and build a ring of very expensive speaker wire for the next step in understanding matter and energy?

David

David
The point is, you only need a few audiophools who are desperate to find something 'wrong' with their babies (and the US has a huge population, many of whom who are rich and suitably gullible) and at the prices they charge, sellers of audiophool equipment have a viable market and can make good living. That's what annoys me, that someone with a good acting ability (read conman) can make something and sell it at a truly extortionate price, justified on extremely thin grounds to gullible people. Meanwhile they write pseudo scientific rubbish 'explaining' how it works. The word 'energy' being a much overused one and also a preoccupation with noise and nebulous sources of interference that in the real world of hifi affect the final sonic assault in the same way that throwing a grain of sand into the sea raises its level. How many people have access to or indeed use a truly 'pin drop' quiet listening room anyway?! Heck, I listen to my hifi while getting on with things walking around the house, and I truly enjoy it!
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