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Old 18th Aug 2019, 7:48 pm   #1
Ryan_1993
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Default A Slightly unusual Candlestick Telephone

Hi all,

Just won the bid on this really quite nice Candlestick telephone. However, I'm struggling to find any specific details on it. It doesn't appear to be a GPO 150.

My best guess would be that its a TELEPHONE No. 124 as it seems to be a close match, but the only photos I've found of the 124 are in black and white so I'm not sure if the surround mouth piece is meant to be brass or ebonite.

The telephone has markings ST'28 and a No 1 again not really familiar. The patent code on the dial seems to relate to a Siemens Brothers Patent so appears to be a dial Dial, Automatic, No. 8FA.

Bidding on it went pretty crazy at the last minute and I ended up paying 178 which is more than I wanted, but if it is a Tele 124 with an early dial fitted I think it might have paid off perhaps. I am hoping that because bidding went crazy my hunch might be correct LOL.

I just hope to god it isn't one of the multiples of fakes we are swamped with. I am pretty good at spotting the fake Indian Bakelite telephones due to their poor quality, but my expertise isn't in candlestick telephones.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this

Here are the attached Photos
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Last edited by Ryan_1993; 18th Aug 2019 at 8:14 pm.
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Old 18th Aug 2019, 10:17 pm   #2
Ryan_1993
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Default Re: A Slightly unusual Candlestick Telephone

Someone has suggested this is likely to be a rare Tele No.160 for use on party lines, rather than a No. 124.

When the phone arrives an internal examination should be able to confirm or deny what this actually is, but either way I shouldn't loose any money on it If I ever come to sell it. Even if it's a GPO 150. it seems an early production run, so should fetch quite good money tidied up a bit.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 2:46 am   #3
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Default Re: A Slightly unusual Candlestick Telephone

Another update

Someone has also suggest and more likely is that this is possibly from Stuart Turner Ltd an engineering firm based in Henley on Thames founded in 1906.

If this is the case it seems extremely rare can't find any other telephones made by them online. Although I did see that they were listed as a parts supplier for the GPO.

Its getting rather intriguing all this
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 8:22 am   #4
Dave Moll
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Default Re: A Slightly unusual Candlestick Telephone

Having read the 160 info. on Bob Freshwater's site, I am puzzled how this works. I thought you needed to check the line wasn't in use by the other party before pressing "call exchange" to connect. If connection is done automatically using an additional springset on the switchhook, there is surely no opportunity to check first.
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Old 20th Aug 2019, 3:52 pm   #5
Ryan_1993
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Default Re: A Slightly unusual Candlestick Telephone

Right so my phone arrived a short while ago and I've dissembled it.

Its very interesting, but its nothing like i've ever seen before. It appears to have a very early Copper dial No.8 installed with the smaller label holder as well.

Here are some further photos of it

Does anyone have an ideas what this could actually be?
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Last edited by Ryan_1993; 20th Aug 2019 at 4:08 pm.
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Old 20th Aug 2019, 9:53 pm   #6
Pellseinydd
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Default Re: A Slightly unusual Candlestick Telephone

How many terminals are there on the dial? There appear to be five conductors in the dial cord. The diagram shows a Dial No 10 - they had the copper finger plate with small dial label from their introduction in late 1924 (replacing the Dial No 8 as the 'standard dial' ) until c1930 when the larger dial label holder was introduced .


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Old 21st Aug 2019, 12:13 am   #7
Ryan_1993
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Default Re: A Slightly unusual Candlestick Telephone

Yes, having further researched it appears to be a Dial Number 10 with five contacts. Been told internally it looks quite similar to a 124 series, but not 100%
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Old 26th Oct 2019, 11:26 am   #8
midshires
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Default Re: A Slightly unusual Candlestick Telephone

I know exactly what your telephone is!

I sold one of these at the Avoncroft swapmeet earlier this year for 100. In fact that telephone you bought may well be the same one!

The photo of the paster diagram is too small to see well but if the of the line cord terminals are marked A, B, BZ and R, then that clinches it.

Your telephone was sold by the Relay Automatic Telephone Company for use on one of their small PAXs (private automatic telephone exchanges) that worked on the three-wire system. GEC was another manufacturer that used three-wire telephones on some of their PAXes. In this system DC (rather than AC) was used to ring the telephones. The ringers were trembler bells and the ringing current was sent over a third wire, with the return over one of the line wires. This system is quite clever, as it means you don't need a vibrator or ringing machine to generate AC and telephones do not require a blocking capacitor. Of course, it does mean that the system requires an extra conductor in the line wiring and the use of non-standard telephones, but despite this, the system was more economic than conventional telephones, meaning it was attractive to cash-strapped users. Three-wire telephones continued to be manufactured by GEC well into the 1960s, and three-wire/battery ringing 706s turn up from time to time. In fact, at the Milton Keynes swapmeet a week ago, Chris Elliott sold a three-wire Gecophone to a THG member who actually has a three-wire Relay PAX, so it went to a good home.

The ST manufacturer code stands for Sterling Telephone and Electric Ltd of Dagenham (see Bob's website at https://www.telephonecollecting.org/...ling/Intro.htm ). Sterling made a lot of telephones for the Relay Automatic company.

You can of course use the telephone on a conventional two-wire telephone line, but you will need to provide a conventional AC ringer and capacitor across the A and B wires.

I have attached photos of the paster that was in my 3-wire Relay candlestick (it looks identical to your one, with the bellset dotted), also a photo of the same telephone with its proper bellset (a Gent's dome DC bell on a block of wood). The dial has been replaced by an ATM type 24C (ATM also supplied telephones to the Relay company).

Hope this helps,
Andy.
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