Dansette Conquest/monarch trouble

[ImperialSlug]

Hi, another newbie in trouble I’m afraid. My wife uncovered her Dansette Conquest auto player and surprisingly it played although it needed a little encouragement to get to the right speed. I read the excellent guide that you’ve put together and replaced the omni coloured power lead with a double insulated version being careful to keep the polarity the same. Everything looked remarkably clean. I checked the pins on the valve its an EBC90 and on the component (valve?) next to it simply marked 318/1189. The capacitor is type CRE/PC with three micro F ratings, 32 @275/325V, 16 @275/325 and 25@25V. I then noticed a couple of leads had been cut off and tied out of the way (bottom yellow lead second attachment, white lead third attachment), but since all had been well I reassembled to try again before going on to find a replacement stereo cartridge the current one is a Fulfi TC8M with two styli seemingly labelled TC8G (with the 78 facing upwards) and TC8R (with the 78 facing upwards). Disaster, I can hear the record playing but very quietly and the volume control makes no difference and there is no glow from the valve. The platter runs but not quite at the correct speed and when I advance the lever to reject to switch off, the platter slows right down and I need to manually spin to complete the cycle. I am not in anyones good books. Any help would be appreciated.

[Edward Huggins]

You have the 2 valve, very early, 1958 version of the Dansette "Conquest Auto". I think those 2 yellow wires might have gone to the contact-cooled rectifier. This looks like a small shiny metal object about 1 1/4" square and 1/4" deep. Can you see or find anything like it inside. It will not work without this. To re-assure you you can still buy a suitable Stereo cartridge to replace the old and original BSR TC8M mono version.

[ms660]

So far as I can make out, the disconnected Yellow wire in the 2nd photo is the supply to the valve heaters along with the Black wire from the transformer (the Black wire is a common feed for the valve heaters and HT-ve) You can see where it should connect to here:

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...5&d=1318327782

The White wire in the 3rd photo is a tap for a series connected valve heater chain, this is not used in your record player, just make sure the end where it's been cut is insulated so that the conductor within can't short out to anything.

The amplifier in yours is basically the same as a Dansette type 14-4, if the schematic isn't available for download from the forums manuals down facility and you need one then I can post a copy up in this thread, it shows all but the rectifier and the mains transformer but that shouldn't be a problem so far as the circuit analysis goes.

Lawrence.

[ImperialSlug]

Thanks so much for the replies internet went down earlier so have only just seen them. Edward, found the rectifier from your description thanks, two leads from it (one yellow one red) both seem ok. There was only one yellow lead disconnected and the attachment from MS660 shows exactly where it should go its identical to what is shown. As I am a complete beginner I assume to re-connect the yellow wire I will need to remove the control knobs and the mounting plate to get at the connection. Do I simply carefully lever them off?
What I can't understand is how it was working before I got involved I'm pretty sure I didn't disturb it. (My wife doesn't agree). Is this normal for these antiques? Many thanks

[ImperialSlug]

Have removed control knobs and board but in doing so the black lead which runs with the yellow has now disconnected. Could you possibly send a picture of the underneath of the board to see where it reattaches. Sorry

[ms660]

This is the only photo I can find so far:

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...6&d=1372581449

In that one, the Black wire connects to HT-ve (chassis) the separate HT-ve and chassis tracks on the board are connected together via the tags of the metal can of the triple electrolytic capacitor.

Lawrence.

[ImperialSlug]

Lawrence thanks again, perfect picture for connection. Have ordered new iron to give me the best chance of success.
Edward having looked through the guide was thinking of BSR SC11M or 11H for cartridge replacement will I need a special mounting bracket to attach in the arm?
Cheers
Steve

[Edward Huggins]

These cartridges, or the BSR SC12H, will be fine. You will need to ensure that the replacement cartridge comes with a mounting bracket as the original BSR turnover type is not suitable. Alternatively you can buy a Chinese Chou-Denshi (or very similar) type of cartridge which comes with a standard 1/2" mount and a flip-under LPS/78 cartridge which would be the most economical and many here recommend these. These sell for c.£14-00 from various suppliers on ebay. As all of these types are stereo cartridges, you will need to "bridge" the LH and RH channels on the tag card under the autochanger which you can see on your 3rd photo in your first Post above. Very easy to do.

[ImperialSlug]

Edward thanks for reply. I have now managed to complete the board repairs and all is working well. Having read more pages of forum information and completely bamboozled myself I think I am actually little clearer. The TC8M cartridge is still performing well and all I will ever play are 45's and older stereo LP's so my first thought was to simply find a TC8S stylus, however the consensus seemed to be this would still potentially damage the records. I would like to keep the turnover style of cartridge (with the protruding knob) so I then thought the Ronette 105 would be ok but the output is only 250mV as against the current 400mV maybe this would still be ok. I also saw reference to a Vac Luxor stylus which I may be able to try with my existing cartridge if I can get it to fit perhaps this is worth a try. Finally I looked for the Chinese cartridges and found a NOS Pfanstiehl P-313 Cartridge with Needle/Stylus #702-S7,S3 Ronette 208/A1 which is a turnover type on e-bay but don't know what the output is.

Am I being too pedantic since the Conquest is hardly really stereo and I won't play these records on anything else? Sorry for the rant and thanks again for the pointers.
Steve

[Edward Huggins]

No, these are not the type of "Chinese" cartridges I mean. A simple search for "Chinese Ceramic Stereo cartridges LP/78" will turn up a selection, some single stylus and some without a mounting clip. All very good and very cheap. Yes, you can very easily fit a BSR TC8S stylus to your BSR TC8M cartridge and it will have the correct stereo tip diameter - BUT - the vertical compliance will be very poor given the type of stylus shank and that type of cartridge. I still best suggest a LP/78 cheap flip-under and you'll get the best of all worlds. And at 250mV, it will still adequately drive your amplifier.

[ImperialSlug]

Just received replacement grommets since I decided the existing ones were a bit perished.
Edward thanks again for your input, I found the cartridges as you suggested. I would really like to keep the turnover type cartridge but if I can't achieve this then I will follow your suggestion.
Lawrence for info the base of the board was indeed marked 14.4 as you had indicated.
Thanks again for all the help I hadn't realised how many dedicated enthusiasts there were or quite how many combinations of deck, cartridge and stylus existed.

[Techman]

You can fit a Chinese cartridge between the metal prongs of an old TC8, I've done it. You'll need to file indents/slots in the plastic sides of the cartridge with a needle file - a 'dob' of Araldite is optional. You keep the turnover flag for decorative purposes - obviously you leave it set to 'red LP' showing upwards, as you won't be using it to 'turn-over' any more...Job done!

[vic0239]

I did something similar with my SC11M. I wanted to retain the look of the original and managed to attach the turnover knob (with the help of some superglue). You can just see the SC11M’s turnover lever protruding slightly, but I’m happy with the overall effect.

[ImperialSlug]

Fantastic, thank you both, that is everything I could have asked for enables me to get compliance and looks. Dare I ask one more question. I've noticed when a record drops the turntable slows momentarily then resumes and is ok. It also doesn't always switch off at the end of a cycle. I've assumed this is due to grease problems and have stripped everything down again and this time managed to remove the cam (with the help of soldering iron). Is there anything else that I might need to do?

[Edward Huggins]

It's often just down to a lack of use.
But it's important that to ensure that there is enough torque generated off the platter.
So do double check the idler-wheel-to-stepped spindle and idler-wheel-to-inner-turntable-rim grip.
You can gently roughen the idler rim and add talc to the platter inner rim.

[ImperialSlug]

Well lack of use is certainly a factor. I have roughened the idler wheel and have adjusted it so that it contacts the spindle in the correct place. I've also thoroughly cleaned the inside rim of the platter, wouldn't the addition of talc reduce the friction though, or is this a trick of the trade.

Thanks
Steve