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Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players Open-reel tape recorders, cassette recorders, 8-track players etc. |
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20th Feb 2018, 7:56 am | #1 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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N4307 Phillips open reel motor
I have an N4307 Phillips open reel were the motor is burnt out. Am having difficulty in finding a new motor from an exact model. Are there any other players I could use a motor from
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20th Feb 2018, 10:13 am | #2 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Near Swindon, North Wiltshire, UK.
Posts: 3,595
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
What is the exact model number of your machine? There were two types of motor fitted. The later type also supplied power for the electronics. The full model number should be on a paper label stuck inside the mains lead stowage compartment underneath.
N4307/15 or N4307/55? |
20th Feb 2018, 6:15 pm | #3 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
Thanks I will check later and post
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20th Feb 2018, 9:16 pm | #4 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Near Swindon, North Wiltshire, UK.
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
It will also be helpful to quote the 12 (numerical) digit code number marked on the faulty motor itself (or on a paper label stuck to it).
It'll be of the form/something like 3113 103 12345. |
21st Feb 2018, 10:08 pm | #5 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
Sorry for the delay. Here are the numbers on the motor is 432 201 000600. Other number is N4307/1
Thanks Kevin |
21st Feb 2018, 10:50 pm | #6 |
Dekatron
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
Hi,
Can you post a photo of the motor? I have a scrap Philips machine here somewhere with its motor. A long shot, but it may just be suitable. It does not supply power to the electronics as it has only two wires. Cheers, Pete.
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"Hello?, Yes, I'm on the train, I might lose the signal soon as we're just going into a tunn..." Last edited by Tractorfan; 21st Feb 2018 at 10:54 pm. Reason: Extra info. |
21st Feb 2018, 11:19 pm | #7 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
Thanks Pete. I'll take a pic tomorrow and post as have packed it away. Be great if it's suitable. Thanks again. Kevin
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21st Feb 2018, 11:30 pm | #8 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Near Swindon, North Wiltshire, UK.
Posts: 3,595
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
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22nd Feb 2018, 12:01 am | #9 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
I'll check the number tomorrow as am posting a pic as well. Thanks Kevin
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22nd Feb 2018, 12:46 pm | #10 |
Dekatron
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Location: Near Swindon, North Wiltshire, UK.
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
Here is the official Philips UK service manual supplement, covering the N4307/55 version.
In the /55 version, the separate mains transformer is eliminated and replaced by a different type of motor, with separate windings to supply power to the electronic circuitry. There were also changes to the drive system and drive belts. The image is from the original N4307/15 (UK version) service manual, showing part of the circuit diagram, with a separate mains transformer and motor. Last edited by dazzlevision; 22nd Feb 2018 at 1:10 pm. Reason: Additional information. |
22nd Feb 2018, 1:14 pm | #11 |
Pentode
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Coventry, West Midlands, UK.
Posts: 199
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
This is a new one. First in my life that I've heard of a burnt Philips reel to Reel motor. before you put the new one in, make sure your cycle and voltage settings are right. I think these motors were 100- 110v and we're powered by the mains transformer by stepping down the voltage. It's been long but check the voltage to the motor with a multimeter as your transformer might be giving something higher or may be short. No point putting in a new motor if your transformer is bad. Or maybe the transformer isn't powering the motor and your motor isn't even bad. Check your transformer output.
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22nd Feb 2018, 3:36 pm | #12 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Near Swindon, North Wiltshire, UK.
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
As the previous post says, it is unusual for one of these motors to burn out and depending upon which of the two types of motor it is, you will need to make some checks/tests before risking damage to a replacement motor.
Possible causes are: seized bearings short circuit turns in the motor windings incorrect mains voltage selector setting causing overheating If the motor is the later type, which also supplies the electronics, is there a short circuit or high current being drawn by the load? |
22nd Feb 2018, 10:01 pm | #13 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
Here's a couple of pictures. I set the setting to 110 and the motor worked but started smoking straight away. Any ideas
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22nd Feb 2018, 10:33 pm | #14 |
Dekatron
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Location: Near Swindon, North Wiltshire, UK.
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
If you set the tape recorder's mains adjustment to "110V", but connected it to our UK mains supply of 230V, it's no wonder the motor started to smoke!
You must set the mains adjustment to "240V" (the closest to 230V) and leave it there. Once you've done that, does the motor now run and not smoke/overheat? |
22nd Feb 2018, 11:14 pm | #15 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
No there's nothing then, so to me a real conundrum. The picture not great but the burn marks were their when I opened it up. Thanks for the attachments, it's unusual for transformer and motor combined. Interesting that it works at 110 but not on any of the other settings. Is it just shorting out. The transformer wires are blackened and sticky in parts
Last edited by clinchy; 22nd Feb 2018 at 11:41 pm. |
23rd Feb 2018, 7:39 am | #16 |
Moderator
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
It maybe that the winding for 240V went open circuit, either way you need a new motor or the original rewound.
Using the motor as a transformer is not a new idea at all. |
23rd Feb 2018, 9:10 am | #17 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
Thanks Michael. I'll be on the look out for a new motor as love to hear this player work
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23rd Feb 2018, 9:40 am | #18 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Near Swindon, North Wiltshire, UK.
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
Looking at your photos again, I see that there is no separate mains transformer, so your N4307 motor is the later type, that also supplies power to the electronics. At least that narrows down the exact type you will need to replace the failed motor in your machine. However, as you powered up the machine with 230V UK mains, whilst the recorder's mains adjustment was set to 110V, it is possible that you have caused damage to the electronics.
I see that the tape counter belt is missing, but there is a capstan flywheel belt present. As you may know, Philips tape recorders of this vintage develop "gooey drive belt syndrome", where the belts slowly disintegrate into a horrible sticky goo. The same thing also happens to the clutch rubber parts fitted inside the spool turntables (four rubber pieces per turntable). Has your machine had the original goo cleaned off and all these parts replaced? |
23rd Feb 2018, 9:53 am | #19 |
Triode
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Abbey Wood, London, UK.
Posts: 21
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
I'll check this weekend. The main drive belt had snapped and no outside evidence of any goo.if I can get a motor for the player I will get the new set of belts and fingers crossed no damage to electronics. All my other players have only needed mechanical repairs, so this is a new venture with motor etc
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23rd Feb 2018, 10:34 am | #20 |
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Middlewich, Cheshire, UK. & Winter in the Philippines.
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Re: N4307 Phillips open reel motor
You will have to be very very lucky for the electronics not to be badly damaged, 110% overload is a heck of a lot.
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