Pye stereophonic 1005 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

PaulMar · 25th Mar 2023, 11:40 am

Good morning, just purchased one of these, identical to family one of 1964.
I am missing a handbook. Would anyone have a scanned copy that they would be kind enough to share please?

I am going to change the stylus-is it worthwhile getting the whole cartridge new , as I see these are also available at Get the needle?

Any insights on the life of the stylus-is it c.6-80 hours?

Many thanks for any other insights

Chris R · 25th Mar 2023, 1:43 pm

The "Butterfly" cartridge fitted to these is rather unique. The price of the new one you refer to is very expensive (£85). Even the stylus is dear at £23.50.
Are you sure that the cartridge needs replacing? If not, wait until it does and replace it with another ceramic one which will give decent performance at a much lower price.
The life of the stylus will depend partly on the condition of the records. A diamond one should give you 100+ hours.

Chris R

Edward Huggins · 25th Mar 2023, 2:28 pm

More to the, er, point - does the stylus really need replacing? Have you examined it under a, say, X12 glass. Also, it's just not that simple to replace the cartridge with a "chinese red cheapo". There is no adjustment for tracking weight. The BSR UA15 based arm was designed exclusively for the Butterfly cartridge and so is not the standard fitting - and you might find the alternative cartridge does not match the input requirements of the 1005's amplifier. These record players are quirky and unique!

PaulMar · 25th Mar 2023, 5:57 pm

Dear Chris and Edward,

many thanks for your prompt replies

I was assuming the stylus has never been replaced and I know it has been used extensively, but well cared for. I thought it worthwhile starting with a new one

I hadn't realised there might be an issue with generic low cost low quality replacements-have you any recommendations as to how I can ensure quality replacements please.

I see 'Get the needle' has them as 'new unused generic replacement stylus', with their name on it. Do you have any views please

Many thanks for any further help you may be able to give

Paul

Chris R · 25th Mar 2023, 6:15 pm

Edward is quite correct. The arm was designed specifically for use with this cartridge which "floats" in its mounting. The tracking weight was preset by the manufacturer and is stated as being 2.25 t0 2.75 grams. There is a small amount of adjustment at the rear of the arm, which is done by slackening the securing screws before moving the counter weight to achieve this. The arm is mounted on rubber bushes and it is important not to raise it higher than its normal operating height.
This is a very light stylus force for the UA15 and it is not unknown to have tracking problems due to friction in the the arm bearing. It is important therefore to ensure that the deck is kept in good order.

Chris R

ajgriff · 25th Mar 2023, 7:34 pm

If you haven't found them already these two documents might be of interest.

Alan

Edward Huggins · 26th Mar 2023, 12:19 pm

On reading the OP's Post#4 can we now assume that the cartridge is OK and the only remaining query is the stylus. If so, I would carefully search out the availablity of the Pye Butterfly Stereo Stylus from Musonic, Needles and Spins, Mantra Audio and Tonar - if they have them is stock. These are almost unobtanium and so if you find none to compare with, then go with the one you have found. The price at £23-50 is fair. These are tricky to fit, so make notes/diagrams of how you dismantle the old stylus. Nothing about this record player is easy!

PaulMar · 26th Mar 2023, 7:46 pm

Dear Chris, Alan and Edward,
Many thanks.

I am still looking for the handbook that came with the player , if anyone has access

Due to your comments, my wish to replace the stylus and the need to adjust where the arm comes down on the vinyl (currently 10 seconds into the music), I think I would prefer to get some help.

I am Bucks based, easily commutable to Reading, Oxford and W London etc. Is it appropriate to ask if anyone might know where I can go to find these skills please?
many thanks
Paul

Edward Huggins · 27th Mar 2023, 9:07 am

You can adjust the tone arm set-down position yourself. On the "standard" BSR UA15, there is a small screw facing you just where the tone arm hinges when you lift the arm up. It should also be there on yours. You will only need a very small adjustment to the left or right.

PaulMar · 31st Mar 2023, 7:44 am

Edward,

many thanks for your 4 recommendations on trying to source the stylus, each now being followed up, but -as you say, this is looking rare.

Mantra have one but they say this is LP/78 with a tracking wt of 4.0gms whereas the red top on the arm is SO/LP and you have already indicated a tracking wt of 2.25-2.75.

Do you think this is a different one? (I have no interests in 78s)

Much appreciate any input.

By chance, would you have a photocopy of the handbook [ls for the Type 1005?

many thanks
Paul

Edward Huggins · 31st Mar 2023, 11:20 am

Are you sure the Mantra one is for LP and 78? The arm will not track at 4 grms as its downweight is set at c.2.5 grams.

PaulMar · 31st Mar 2023, 11:50 am

Dear Edward,

Further to my post above, I have just spoken to Phil at Musonic. He checked and has confirmed there was an error on the website and the tracking weight was as you had suggested.
He informs me the diamond tips should be good for 400-600 hours on the LP.
All ordered, so I much appreciate your sound advice and wise counsel

All i need now is a copy of the original red/white handbook, still looking...
Many thanks, very grateful
Paul

PaulMar · 1st Apr 2023, 5:02 pm

Dear Edward,

May I ask you another question please?
I have found a post of yours dating back to 2015 in reply to a thread of David Fanning, which, in part says "The cartridge arrangement was unique to this player. It was fitted to a BSR UA15 turntable with a tone arm specially modified for us. The purpose of the little red knob was to turn the stlyus from Mono to Stereo as it was never envisaged that this player would be used for 78's."

I know the little red button is marked (my replacement )'LP/SO'. The stylus I have bought from Musonic is a pair of diamond tips on both ends, for LPs.

I have separately heard from another seller, who has sold many of them as follows "As far as I know, these styluses were all made with a 78 tip on one side and an LP tip the other. Certainly the two I have left both that type.One is diamond and sapphire and the other is sapphire and sapphire."
Can you enlighten me-what is the role of the red button but to switch between the stylis-one for 78s and the other LPs? I presume one just needs to assign the 78 stylus to either LP or SO?
I see you mention the turntable was never designed for 78s, but that speed is one of the options.
Or am I missing something else?
Any help would be gratefully received, if you are still willing
With grateful thanks
Paul

Edward Huggins · 2nd Apr 2023, 11:11 am

Now I should know the answer as this unit was never envisioned to be used for 78s. Even so, there may be a Stereo LP/78 aftermarket option. The red button swings the stylus from LP to SO. From memory the LP tip was diamond for Stereo LPs and the SO tip was sapphire Mono LPs.

25th Mar 2023, 11:40 am	#1
PaulMar Diode Join Date: Mar 2023 Location: Marlow, Buckinghamshire, UK. Posts: 6	Pye stereophonic 1005 Good morning, just purchased one of these, identical to family one of 1964. I am missing a handbook. Would anyone have a scanned copy that they would be kind enough to share please? I am going to change the stylus-is it worthwhile getting the whole cartridge new , as I see these are also available at Get the needle? Any insights on the life of the stylus-is it c.6-80 hours? Many thanks for any other insights

25th Mar 2023, 1:43 pm	#2
Chris R Pentode Join Date: Nov 2021 Location: Laurencekirk, Kincardineshire, Scotland, UK. Posts: 161	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 The "Butterfly" cartridge fitted to these is rather unique. The price of the new one you refer to is very expensive (£85). Even the stylus is dear at £23.50. Are you sure that the cartridge needs replacing? If not, wait until it does and replace it with another ceramic one which will give decent performance at a much lower price. The life of the stylus will depend partly on the condition of the records. A diamond one should give you 100+ hours. Chris R

25th Mar 2023, 2:28 pm	#3
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 7,879	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 More to the, er, point - does the stylus really need replacing? Have you examined it under a, say, X12 glass. Also, it's just not that simple to replace the cartridge with a "chinese red cheapo". There is no adjustment for tracking weight. The BSR UA15 based arm was designed exclusively for the Butterfly cartridge and so is not the standard fitting - and you might find the alternative cartridge does not match the input requirements of the 1005's amplifier. These record players are quirky and unique! __________________ Edward.

25th Mar 2023, 6:15 pm	#5
Chris R Pentode Join Date: Nov 2021 Location: Laurencekirk, Kincardineshire, Scotland, UK. Posts: 161	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 Edward is quite correct. The arm was designed specifically for use with this cartridge which "floats" in its mounting. The tracking weight was preset by the manufacturer and is stated as being 2.25 t0 2.75 grams. There is a small amount of adjustment at the rear of the arm, which is done by slackening the securing screws before moving the counter weight to achieve this. The arm is mounted on rubber bushes and it is important not to raise it higher than its normal operating height. This is a very light stylus force for the UA15 and it is not unknown to have tracking problems due to friction in the the arm bearing. It is important therefore to ensure that the deck is kept in good order. Chris R

26th Mar 2023, 12:19 pm	#7
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 7,879	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 On reading the OP's Post#4 can we now assume that the cartridge is OK and the only remaining query is the stylus. If so, I would carefully search out the availablity of the Pye Butterfly Stereo Stylus from Musonic, Needles and Spins, Mantra Audio and Tonar - if they have them is stock. These are almost unobtanium and so if you find none to compare with, then go with the one you have found. The price at £23-50 is fair. These are tricky to fit, so make notes/diagrams of how you dismantle the old stylus. Nothing about this record player is easy! __________________ Edward.

25th Mar 2023, 5:57 pm	#4
PaulMar Diode Join Date: Mar 2023 Location: Marlow, Buckinghamshire, UK. Posts: 6	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 Dear Chris and Edward, many thanks for your prompt replies I was assuming the stylus has never been replaced and I know it has been used extensively, but well cared for. I thought it worthwhile starting with a new one I hadn't realised there might be an issue with generic low cost low quality replacements-have you any recommendations as to how I can ensure quality replacements please. I see 'Get the needle' has them as 'new unused generic replacement stylus', with their name on it. Do you have any views please Many thanks for any further help you may be able to give Paul

26th Mar 2023, 7:46 pm	#8
PaulMar Diode Join Date: Mar 2023 Location: Marlow, Buckinghamshire, UK. Posts: 6	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 Dear Chris, Alan and Edward, Many thanks. I am still looking for the handbook that came with the player , if anyone has access Due to your comments, my wish to replace the stylus and the need to adjust where the arm comes down on the vinyl (currently 10 seconds into the music), I think I would prefer to get some help. I am Bucks based, easily commutable to Reading, Oxford and W London etc. Is it appropriate to ask if anyone might know where I can go to find these skills please? many thanks Paul

27th Mar 2023, 9:07 am	#9
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 7,879	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 You can adjust the tone arm set-down position yourself. On the "standard" BSR UA15, there is a small screw facing you just where the tone arm hinges when you lift the arm up. It should also be there on yours. You will only need a very small adjustment to the left or right. __________________ Edward.

31st Mar 2023, 7:44 am	#10
PaulMar Diode Join Date: Mar 2023 Location: Marlow, Buckinghamshire, UK. Posts: 6	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 Edward, many thanks for your 4 recommendations on trying to source the stylus, each now being followed up, but -as you say, this is looking rare. Mantra have one but they say this is LP/78 with a tracking wt of 4.0gms whereas the red top on the arm is SO/LP and you have already indicated a tracking wt of 2.25-2.75. Do you think this is a different one? (I have no interests in 78s) Much appreciate any input. By chance, would you have a photocopy of the handbook [ls for the Type 1005? many thanks Paul

31st Mar 2023, 11:20 am	#11
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 7,879	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 Are you sure the Mantra one is for LP and 78? The arm will not track at 4 grms as its downweight is set at c.2.5 grams. __________________ Edward.

31st Mar 2023, 11:50 am	#12
PaulMar Diode Join Date: Mar 2023 Location: Marlow, Buckinghamshire, UK. Posts: 6	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 Dear Edward, Further to my post above, I have just spoken to Phil at Musonic. He checked and has confirmed there was an error on the website and the tracking weight was as you had suggested. He informs me the diamond tips should be good for 400-600 hours on the LP. All ordered, so I much appreciate your sound advice and wise counsel All i need now is a copy of the original red/white handbook, still looking... Many thanks, very grateful Paul

1st Apr 2023, 5:02 pm	#13
PaulMar Diode Join Date: Mar 2023 Location: Marlow, Buckinghamshire, UK. Posts: 6	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 Dear Edward, May I ask you another question please? I have found a post of yours dating back to 2015 in reply to a thread of David Fanning, which, in part says "The cartridge arrangement was unique to this player. It was fitted to a BSR UA15 turntable with a tone arm specially modified for us. The purpose of the little red knob was to turn the stlyus from Mono to Stereo as it was never envisaged that this player would be used for 78's." I know the little red button is marked (my replacement )'LP/SO'. The stylus I have bought from Musonic is a pair of diamond tips on both ends, for LPs. I have separately heard from another seller, who has sold many of them as follows "As far as I know, these styluses were all made with a 78 tip on one side and an LP tip the other. Certainly the two I have left both that type.One is diamond and sapphire and the other is sapphire and sapphire." Can you enlighten me-what is the role of the red button but to switch between the stylis-one for 78s and the other LPs? I presume one just needs to assign the 78 stylus to either LP or SO? I see you mention the turntable was never designed for 78s, but that speed is one of the options. Or am I missing something else? Any help would be gratefully received, if you are still willing With grateful thanks Paul

2nd Apr 2023, 11:11 am	#14
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 7,879	Re: Pye stereophonic 1005 Now I should know the answer as this unit was never envisioned to be used for 78s. Even so, there may be a Stereo LP/78 aftermarket option. The red button swings the stylus from LP to SO. From memory the LP tip was diamond for Stereo LPs and the SO tip was sapphire Mono LPs. __________________ Edward.