Bush SRP31D Record Player with BSR UA16 Monarch Deck.

[dorabella]

My thanks to all for your advice. I'll check things straight away. I may need further advice re rectifiers/capacitors etc. But I am grateful for the help.
Sincerely,

Dorabella

[dorabella]

Quick update -

I've checked the fuse/6v bulb, it looks undamaged with the inside wire intact. I've also cleaned it and surrounding area.

However, nothing changes: red light off; motor working.

Again, any advice gratefully received.

Sincerely,

Dorabella

[julie_m]

Have you got a multimeter?

[dorabella]

Thank you for responding.

No I don't. How would I use it?

[julie_m]

You will be fine for now with a cheap multimeter -- don't spend more than £10, maybe even less than £5 on your first one. Even the most basic one will be suitable for working on old record players and radios. It will be just as accurate as anything that was around when the record player was made; and if you manage somehow to break it, you can afford to throw it away and buy another one.

If your local street or indoor market has a stall selling tools, or random electronic goodies, they might well sell multimeters; otherwise, try The Usual Places online. It's also useful to have a couple of short (20cm. or so) leads with a crocodile clip with a rubber insulating boot on each end, so you can connect up the meter probes to the machine "in advance" with it switched off, and then power it up once your hands are well clear of any dangerous voltages. It's often useful to be able to have the negative lead (or when working on pre-1980s transistor radios, the positive lead) connected to one fixed point in the circuit, so you can probe various other points for voltages.

Once you have your meter, post a photo of it, making sure the main selector knob and all the markings around it are clearly visible; and also some pictures of the amplifier unit inside. Also, if you haven't already, get a copy of the service information (available from the link "up top" for £1.99, which goes towards the running costs of the forum). Somebody here will then be able to describe in detail a sequence of tests that you can do: first some simple continuity checks with the player unpowered and then, depending on the results, some voltage tests which will require the player to be powered up.

[dorabella]

Thank you, Julie.
I just looked online and see that Halfords and Screwfix are selling multimeters for less than £10.00. I'll try to get one and hope it will help me to find out what's gone wrong.
I've also found some sites which give a step by step advice on how to test circuits. Of course I'll follow your advice re. the link "up top".

Once again,

Many thanks

Dorabella

[Herald1360]

If you buy from Halfords, make sure it's a general purpose meter rather than a car electrics biassed one. Though nowadays I guess most of the old engine related measurements are no longer relevant.

The under a tenner Screwfix one looks fine and looks like it comes with dual purpose clip-on or prod type probes which may be quite useful

[dorabella]

Dear Julie
Downloaded a copy of the service manual.

Off to Screwfix now.

Don't understand the last diagram with "o Chris"

Sincerely

[Herald1360]

It's my "signature". It should look like a text picture of an old Landrover with my name between the wheels but some mail programs strip out the formatting and display it as gibberish!

[dorabella]

Julie - Now it looks like a landrover. 2 wheels or 4 ?

Seriously,

I have the meter and will now study the circuits etc. Probably take a few days. I'll keep you posted.

thanks for all your advice.

Dorabella

[Herald1360]

Errrr..... that's Chris with the Landie. 1970, 2A, 109, 12seat estate, 200Tdi for those wot knows. It has 4 wheels, only two visible in the signature!

Better get back on topic- the SRP31D should be a good performer when it's sorted with its half decent p-p amp. Hopefully you won't need to replace any ECL86s, you're looking at £25+ each these days

[julie_m]

If this is the meter you've bought, that's fine!

Here are the first round of tests you can do, as soon as you are ready:

1. Unplug the player from the mains. Make sure the on-off switch (integrated into the volume control) is OFF and the record changer OFF/ON/AUTO lever is also OFF.

2. Select 2kΩ range on multimeter and connect test leads.

3. Note what the display looks like while the two probes are not connected to anything (probably just a figure "1" in the left-hand position). This is an open circuit or overload indication.

(If you ever see this overload indication while trying to measure a voltage or current, disconnect one of the probes immediately! Multimeters at this price point do not have any overload protection and will be damaged if left too long like this. However, it's perfectly fine to see overload when measuring resistance. It just means that the resistance is more than the meter can measure. It could be an open circuit -- no connection at all -- or you might just need to select a higher range.)

4. Hold one probe in each hand, angle them so the metal tips are crossing over and then press them firmly against each other. The display should read "0" or something very low. If it is flashing random numbers, you probably are just not pressing hard enough to get a good connection. This is a short circuit indication.

(Note that 2kΩ = 2000Ω. Some meters will display the value as a whole number of ohms; others will insert a decimal point before the three digits, so displaying the value as a fraction of a kilo-ohm.)

5. Press the red meter probe firmly against the live pin of the mains plug, and the black meter probe firmly against the neutral pin of the mains plug. What reading do you get? (It should be "overload" because when the power switch is "off", the mains lead is disconnected from the transformer.) But this range can only measure up to 2000Ω; if the resistance is 2001Ω, it will read as though it was an open circuit. So try again on each of the higher resistance ranges up to 2MΩ, to make sure. Remember when posting each measurement, to state the meter reading and the selected range.

6. Turn on the record player with the off/on/volume knob (it does not matter how loud you turn it up, this test is not going to make any sounds. But it will connect up the power transformer, and so should show a resistance which will be less than 2kΩ). Set the meter back to the 2kΩ range. Press the meter probes against the plug pins as in the previous test. What reading do you get? Again, try higher ranges if necessary.

7. Leave the off/on/volume knob in an "on" position but move the record changer OFF/ON/AUTO lever to ON. (This will connect the motor into circuit, and should reduce the resistance even more.) Set the meter back to the 2kΩ range if you changed it. Press the meter probes against the plug pins as in the previous test. What reading do you get?

8. That's all for now! Return the OFF/ON/AUTO lever to OFF and turn the off/on/volume control back to "off". Don't forget to turn the meter OFF, to protect the battery in it.

[dorabella]

Dear Julie,

Thank you for your mail and the very welcome advice.

I think the problem is solved. Using the meter (Yes, the one from Screwfix) I found that there was no connectivity between the live wire from the on/off switch to the fuse. I replaced the wire and now everything is working fine.

I also carried out the tests you mentioned in your post. Everything went well and now I feel I can manage a multimeter adequately.

Thank you also for introducing me to your landrover. It's a novel idea to use your car in place of your signature.

Once again,

Thanks for everything.

Sincerely,

Dorabella.

[julie_m]

Er -- Chris is the one with the Land Rover! I'm congenitally incapable of operating a motor vehicle at anything more than walking pace (good at bump-starting though, had plenty of practice .....)

Anyway, glad to hear you managed OK with the meter. Now you've already done the scary bit, here's the full explanation: 1 and 2 were setting-up, 3 and 4 were to get to know the two important indications. 5 should have been open circuit, 6 I was expecting open circuit although it should have been a low resistance; here we were looking to see if or not any power was able to get through to the amplifier's mains transformer. 7 was testing to see if switching the motor into circuit made any difference, and should have resulted in a lower resistance than 6; if not, that would mean the fault lay upstream of where the wires to the amplifier and record changer diverged.

[dorabella]

Hi all,

I keep this in garage. Now after the winter I find that everything works but there is no sound. The red "on" light is working. I've checked the wiring and this seems to be OK. Any advice will be appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Dorabella

[Edward Huggins]

The cartridge connectors may have oxidised whilst out there in the garage. Spray these with a contact cleaner and/or carefully slide them off from their connecting pins and reconnect them using tweezers. Whilst the connectors are off, gently touch them with your finger and you should get a healthy buzz in the amplifier with the volume turned up. If you do, then the amplifier will be OK and the cartridge may now be suspect.

[dorabella]

Thanks Edward, I'll try that. Cheers

[Ekcoman]

If you keep in the garage. Next time store in a large good quality plastic bag. In that way your player will be fairly well protected from the damp & cold conditions of a garage. Crystal cartridges are particularly susceptible to damp conditions.

[slidertogrid]

If there is no slight background hum and no buzz when the cartridge connectors are touched it may be that the rectifier has failed. The small square rectifiers on these Bush record players often do. Sometimes the H.T voltage is very low and surprisingly the amplifier continues to work but if it fails completely there will be no sound at all. There is a bulb on the front of the amp chassis labelled as a fuse, check that is is tight in it's holder and that the bulb is OK. To be honest I can't remember if the lamp is just used as a HT fuse or as a fuse for the whole amplifier.
Make sure the record player is unplugged before dismantling though....
To gain access to the fuse bulb you have to remove the black control escutcheon, there are three screws to remove one each end and one in the middle.
Another thing to check is the plug at the left hand rear of the record deck if it corrodes in the socket or becomes dislodged it can also cause no sound.
Rich

[dorabella]

Originally Posted by Ekcoman

If you keep in the garage. Next time store in a large good quality plastic bag. In that way your player will be fairly well protected from the damp & cold conditions of a garage. Crystal cartridges are particularly susceptible to damp conditions.

Thanks so much for the advice. I will next time. cheers.