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Old 17th Oct 2007, 11:24 pm   #1
PJL
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Default Civilian/utility set finish?

I bought a utility set for £3 from a car boot with a knob missing, a little woodworm damage and the finish is not so good but the internals are as new and completely untouched.

I am going to have a go at a back to new restoration, constructing new cabinet verticals to replace the woodworm damaged ones and restoring the finish back to original colours.

BUT what were the original colours? Under the now missing top label the finish is a light yellow similar to new pine but the rest including the internal timbers are a shade of orange. Is this oxidisation? nicotine? UV? has the label adhesive bleached the timber?

My suspicion is it would have been quite garish with natural yellow pine and a fairly dark walnut tone to the verticals all in a sparingly applied nitro-cellulose gloss finish? Any opinions before I get out the bleach?...Peter
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Old 17th Oct 2007, 11:35 pm   #2
chipp1968
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

From memory of ones ive seen ,owned .I no longer have one ... they are quite yellow plywood , no fancy veneer , varnished look about them .
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Old 17th Oct 2007, 11:53 pm   #3
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

We had quite a discussion of this matter not so long ago https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ad.php?t=11210 , so I'll not get on my soapbox again

Paul
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Old 18th Oct 2007, 10:04 am   #4
PJL
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

Thanks Paul, I should have searched first! I wonder if the manufacturers applied what finish they had available? This ones a U12 and definitely had a light gloss finish visible under the label. I am equally sure the toner spray on the verticals could only have been a factory finish.
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Old 18th Oct 2007, 10:30 am   #5
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

Yes, it does seem to be so on a minority of sets, maybe up to a quarter. As the knobs and 'speaker cloth are clearly often whatever was lying around the particular factory from recently produced models - my Plessey set for instance sports a couple of Defiant knobs - maybe whatever basic cabinet finish was to hand would have been applied too. Here's an unrestored set with toned columns and a lightly restored one that's never had them (sanded down where necessary, then linseed oil - full vintage orange box effect )

Paul
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Old 18th Oct 2007, 10:39 am   #6
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

I have one which a previous owner 'restored' by using gloss varnish - it isn't a good look - I would advise linseed or french polish (or whatever you have hanging around would seem appropriate!)

Cheers
Andy
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Old 18th Oct 2007, 10:51 am   #7
Leon Crampin
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

PJL, I happen to have a U12 Utility set (Burndept). Mine is in pretty good original condition - the front "columns" have definitely been treated from new with a light varnish and brown stain. The cabinet has a very light coating of varnish - it's hard to say whether or not it's stained as pine darkens considerably with age.

Electrically, there are no surprises - the Westector detector is fitted and working and two of the valves (EF and EL) are the original "BVA" coded types.

Incidentally, does your U12 have the label on the back cover stuck on the wrong side? With the silver "Warning do not remove etc." on the outside, as it should be, the paper label is on the inside. This means it's really well preserved.

Great sets and a piece of history. I must make a little "up convertor" to enable it to receive Droitwich on 198 kHz (if they ever get it working properly) - it could go inside the set and be powered from the back bias line.

Leon.
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Old 18th Oct 2007, 1:25 pm   #8
chipp1968
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

Its interesting if they did variations ,im now wondering if i have seen one with black front columns . but that may have been a dream
seriously though ,These sets were produced with minimum effort , time and money "Utility" I doubt if they would have used two processes in the finishing where one would do the job , one type of laquer in the spraybooths maybe . One thing that may make the columns appear different colours is type of timber . The right hand one in Pauls pics looks like beech . I cant tell what the left hand one is , could be birch etc .
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Old 18th Oct 2007, 6:39 pm   #9
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

Leon, the paper label is on the inside and is good apart from a couple of worm holes in the edge...

As I thought it sounds like the finish is original but has aged to orange from the natural pine.

I have a knob missing - is the remaining one similar to yours in which case I will cast a new one.
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Old 18th Oct 2007, 7:21 pm   #10
Leon Crampin
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

PJL, My set looks almost exactly like yours and has precisely the same knob(s). Your set is more orange than mine and the columns are darker. The weave of the 'speaker cloth is horizontal on my set as yours is - most other Utility sets I've seen have the weave vertical.

The electrical restoration of mine was absolutely straightforward - but I had to add about 10 nF across the primary of the output transformer in addition to the (restored) existing capacitor to tame the rather shrill response.

Let me know if you need any other details - I don't know much about Burndept, but the build standard looks OK.

Leon.

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Old 18th Oct 2007, 11:08 pm   #11
Phil G4SPZ
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon Crampin View Post
I must make a little "up convertor" to enable it to receive Droitwich on 198 kHz (if they ever get it working properly) - it could go inside the set and be powered from the back bias line.
Slightly OT, I know, but... mine has a very simple long wave conversion, which looks like it was a commercially-available modification kit which simply switches additional aerial and oscillator coils into circuit. PM me if you want details.

Phil
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Old 18th Oct 2007, 11:18 pm   #12
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

Hi PJL,

I think I might have a spare knob. However, it's difficult to see it clearly and judge its size.

It'd be a good idea to take a good photograph and post it in the wanted section, even if I can't help somebody else might

David
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Old 19th Oct 2007, 2:02 pm   #13
Leon Crampin
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

Phil, If it's not off topic I would be interested to see the detail of your LW converter (possibly start another thread). I'm not at all keen to make any alterations to the chassis on this set - let alone fit a wavechange switch so the up-converter is an obvious mod. It would just bring what's left of Droitwich into a quiet spot on the MW band.

Leon.
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Old 19th Oct 2007, 9:59 pm   #14
Phil G4SPZ
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Default Re: Civilian/utility set finish?

Hi Leon,

OK, I can understand your not wanting to modify your set. I will start another thread in the 'electronics' section.

Phil
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