BSR record player deck identification.

[FMarco64]

Hi all,
I thought I could post a Pic of this BSR deck I think it's a McDonald 600 but there is no label anywhere on it.
It was mounted in a music centre but unfortunately all the logos and badges have been removed as well as the amplifier / radio hardware.
So this deck came just with the single play spindle and all the wires cut - I needed to do the usual cleaning and rewire mains and RCA outputs.
The arm has a removable counterbalance which is made in 2 pieces. Has antiskating and graduated scale.
Tonearm wiring is stereo, 4 leads getting out from arm tube under the fixed headshell.
Any information is appreciated, it just needed some cleaning and it restarted flawlessly, keeping a steady 33.39 RPM.

Thank you!
Marco

[Edward Huggins]

This looks very similar to the BSR MCDONALD Model 610 except that the tone arm weight is different. On the 610 it is rectangular and is as used on the BSR P128/MP60. A tip to help date these is that the late BSR Autochangers abandoned the 78 and 16 rpm speeds in their later manufacturing period. This being a 4 speed, suggests it was made before that later period. It could be from about 1972. I'm glad it's working as well as you describe.

[FMarco64]

Thanks Edward for your help.
It's hard to find specs or manuals for these models, I'll keep searching. I found some (C141, C159...) and the underside is similar.
It looks like the tonearm is not very common.
I can't make it work automatically - I mean, the start lever (missing, but there's still a bit of plastic to grab - see pic) does not have the typical "auto" position.
The third step is "Reject" - which works fine, as well as the auto return at the end of the record.
So I need to set the lever to "ON" then manually put the arm at the beginning of the record.

[Edward Huggins]

There is a wealth of information about about the automatic functions of an autochanger within the "Stickies" at the top of this page. I suspect that the Trip Pawl needs attention, a very common problem.
Also you can download the BSR MCDONALD 610 service manual for free from Vinyl Engine and also there's a downloadable PDF of the User Operating Guide as well.
I know these documents will be for a 610, but I suspect there is little or no mechanical under-the-deck-plate difference.

[Michael Maurice]

It's more than just the trip pawl, I suspect the mechanism is gummed up from dried grease which is why the plastic control knob broke off.

To repair this, you need to remove the sub chassis, strip it completely, clean it and reassemble with fresh grease.

[ben]

Originally Posted by FMarco64

Hi all,
I thought I could post a Pic of this BSR deck I think it's a McDonald 600 but there is no label anywhere on it.

That's an MA70!
I think I uploaded the manual to vinylengine some time ago.

[FMarco64]

Originally Posted by Michael Maurice

It's more than just the trip pawl, I suspect the mechanism is gummed up from dried grease which is why the plastic control knob broke off.

To repair this, you need to remove the sub chassis, strip it completely, clean it and reassemble with fresh grease.

Thanks Michael - will give it a closer look today or so, I thought I cleaned everything but I did not remove every bit of mechanism.

Originally Posted by ben

That's an MA70!
I think I uploaded the manual to vinylengine some time ago.

Ben - great info, thank you very much. I found no such model in the VE database, there's an MA65 and I just downloaded the owner's manual. It looks exactly the same in its operations, the only visible differences being the counterweight and the mat without the metal ring in the middle.
I'd be interested to have the exact MA70 manual if you still have it.
I thought I found it as McD 600 after seeing old ads for USA and Eastern market, with very small differences though (platter mat, headshell...). Could it be that its name and some refinements changed for different distribution areas...?

[FMarco64]

Originally Posted by Michael Maurice

It's more than just the trip pawl, I suspect the mechanism is gummed up from dried grease which is why the plastic control knob broke off.

To repair this, you need to remove the sub chassis, strip it completely, clean it and reassemble with fresh grease.

Hi again Michael
it turns out it works correctly, after reading the owner's manual of the MA65. Leaving the overarm not engaged (on the right side of the deck) allows the arm to correctly leave its rest and go on the record.
To make auto stop work the overarm must be moved to centre and lowered - if not, the arm will go back and will restart indefinitely.
I did not imagine this behavior.
I had a C129 in my parents' house for years when I was a teen, but I don't remember using it this way.
Thanks for you advice - I would like to swap the function broken knob with the record size selector knob which will be rarely used, and this will anyway imply dismantling all the leverage below as I could not find a way to take out those knobs just by removing their bottom screws.
Marco

[Station X]

Without the overarm being swung to the left, the auto- changer won't know when it's played the last record in the case of a stack, or a single record placed directly on the turntable, so it keeps replaying.

[FMarco64]

Swapped the two knobs - now the main features are much more comfortable to operate. Everything goes fine - auto at 12", 10" and 7" included.
Thanks everyone for guidance and patience!
Stay safe and keep on maintaining your vintage gear.
Marco

[Michael Maurice]

You need to work out why the knob broke in the first place, it's mainly due to hardened grease which makes the lever stiff or difficult to move, so the operator puts more force on the knob and it breaks.

Take my advice, remove the sub chassis, dismantle clean and regrease.

[FMarco64]

Originally Posted by Michael Maurice

You need to work out why the knob broke in the first place, it's mainly due to hardened grease which makes the lever stiff or difficult to move, so the operator puts more force on the knob and it breaks.

Take my advice, remove the sub chassis, dismantle clean and regrease.

I did, it works well now.
I think I need to create a new thread now that this deck has become a restoration project posting more pics as the work proceeds.
Better leave this thread to the original scope - identifying BSR models.
I'd like to thank everyone for the precious help I received!

Marco

[Ekcoman]

Thought I'd share this the BSR UA12 a even located a turntable instruction sheet. This in a DANSETTE Conquest. Bit of a odd one as dont think so common as the UA8 and UA14, sort of inbetween? Dates around late 50s, earlly 60's I'm guessing

[david freeman]

Hi
The BSR UA12 was introduced in 1959, as an upmarket alternative to the UA8.
It was used in many of the first stereo record players and radiograms of the time.
It was in production until 1961, when it was replaced by the UA14.
A very short lived model was the UA10, which featured the same control layout, but using different rotaries, as the UA8, with a more streamlined pickup arm, but in the colour scheme of the later UA14.

[Edward Huggins]

The UA14 was essentially a de-cosmeticised version of the UA12 - i.e. more value engineered and, to my eyes, less glamorous. Mechanically, I have never found there to be any other differences.

[Ekcoman]

Originally Posted by Edward Huggins

The UA14 was essentially a de-cosmeticised version of the UA12 - i.e. more value engineered and, to my eyes, less glamorous. Mechanically, I have never found there to be any other differences.

Funny that as deep down my favourite is still the UA14 as was the first deck I knew found on a Defiant Record Player back in late 1962. The early versions lacked the clip over arm retainer and instead sort of clipped in, which wasnt too secure

[John M0GLN]

In case they are of any use I've attached exploded assembly drawings and parts list for the UA-15, I've had to photograph them as the catalogue they are in is very tightly bound and won't scan.

John

[JonnyJa]

This is a Coomber school record player

[FMarco64]

Hi all

Here's another deck I'd like to have information on. It sits in a Nordmende 4004 music centre, of which I found no information anywhere.
I also could not find a BSR deck with such arm type (square arm tube, sliding weight scale on it, finger lift on top of the headshell).

Any help/idea welcome

[FMarco64]

Model found, finally my friend took the deck to my place.
It's a BSR Model C173.A.1.
Will look for info about this one.