This forum

[repairman 1234]

Originally Posted by Radio_Dave

A long time ago we had a thread which question why so many members had pictures of cats as their avatar and it turned out that cats were very popular with our members. Threads about cats are always going to be light hearted and could never cause troubles for the mods.

A thread about the the Olympic torch has no relevance on a radio restoration forum whatsoever and would almost certainly turn into a rant about something or another to do with the negative aspects of the Olympics.

David

Ok, I remember the thread about cats, and yes lots of us (me included) have them and love to talk about them. They have no relevance to radio restoration though.
The Olympic thread was chopped so quick that nobody could see which way it was going to go (maybe lots of us would have found common ground talking about the Olympics in a light hearted manner)

Is it not over moderation to jump in and cut it before even seeing how it would pan out?

[Robert Darwent]

Originally Posted by Radio_Dave

A long time ago we had a thread which question why so many members had pictures of cats as their avatar and it turned out that cats were very popular with our members. Threads about cats are always going to be light hearted and could never cause troubles for the mods.

A thread about the the Olympic torch has no relevance on a radio restoration forum whatsoever and would almost certainly turn into a rant about something or another to do with the negative aspects of the Olympics.

I remember that thread as well, I even had a picture of my own cat as my avatar for a few years. But a thread about cats "has no relevance on a radio restoration forum whatsoever" either David.

Rules must be applied equally and fairly however "light hearted" the subject of the thread.

Regards

[repairman 1234]

Originally Posted by Robert Darwent

I remember that thread as well, I even had a picture of my own cat as my avatar for a few years. But a thread about cats "has no relevance on a radio restoration forum whatsoever" either David.

Rules must be applied equally and fairly however "light hearted" the subject of the thread.

Regards

Here Here

Have a look in that thread, you will see a small write up about our Salem too with a picccy of the monster himself

As Robert has summed up better than me...Rules must be applied equally....

[GrimJosef]

Originally Posted by ThePillenwerfer

I'm for donations ... I can't see any point in making accountants fat either. If Paul vanished to the pub with my donation that's a matter for his conscience and I certainly wouldn't bother myself over it.

- Joe

Originally Posted by Robert Darwent

Something I have also given much consideration over and arrived at the same conclusion Jeffrey.

Regards

For 10-20p per week, or whatever it turns out to be, I think I'm with Joe on this one. Still, as always, we have a range of opinions and if the 'donations model' is chosen we are perfectly free to pay or not. And in my view that is as it should be.

Cheers,

GJ

['LIVEWIRE?']

Perhaps such 'OT' threads could be accommodated in an 'Off Topic' section, such as is to be found on http://diyaudio.comSeems to work alright there. I've just briefly visited DIY Audio for the first time in ages - their 'Off Topic' discussions are now to be found in a section called 'The Lounge'

[ppppenguin]

Originally Posted by 'LIVEWIRE?'

Perhaps such 'OT' threads could be accommodated in an 'Off Topic' section, such as is to be found on http://diyaudio.comSeems to work alright there.

We used to have one here many moons ago. Apparently it got to be too much trouble for the moderators so it was closed.

[Robert Darwent]

Originally Posted by ppppenguin

We used to have one here many moons ago. Apparently it got to be too much trouble for the moderators so it was closed.

So now they just allow the off-topic threads they like and quote the rule book over the ones they don't.

Hardly surprising so much ill-feeling gets generated from time to time and is released in certain threads.

Unfortunately the root cause always fails to be recognised, or if it is, is dismissed as grumbling instead of being fairly addressed.

Regards

[Alistair D]

I have purposely kept out of this discussion and will keep my comments to a minimum.
During my working career a derogatory remark often made about a bad product was that it was designed by committee. In the case of this forum I now believe that the opposite is true. I do not believe that 1 person(and subsidiaries) can apply all of the rules fairly and evenly in such a large forum. Perhaps it is time to invite comment from the BVWS and BATC.

Al

[repairman 1234]

...Then when people who should know better start conversations off with ER.....
OR state that someone lives in another Universe for having the cheek to disagree with them, well, its not helpful is it?

[Sean Williams]

The UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum is a privately-owned and operated discussion forum under the sole authority of its Chief Administrator (Paul Stenning), and run with the aid of additional Administrators and Moderators who act on the Chief Administrator's authority. At all times members of this Forum should follow the instructions and requests of Administrators/Moderators. They are acting on behalf of the Chief Administrator. Questioning their actions or motivations in public messages is not welcome. Instead, should you have an issue with the way a moderator is behaving or disagree with their judgement, you are asked to please contact the Chief Administrator via private message or the "Contact Us" link to express your concerns. Taking matters into your own hands will not be tolerated. This is because our staff is entirely volunteer, and deserves the freedom to be able to do their volunteer jobs.


Also, while we grant our users the utmost discretion and freedom, there is no guaranteed right of free speech (or right toward anything else, for that matter) in this community, and we make no guarantees at all about its operation, its moderation or its policies. The UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum is operated solely at the leisure of the administrators/moderators, in their free time, and no user is guaranteed the right to be here as a participant. We reserve the right to terminate any user's membership for any reason at any time.

For those few members that cannot, or will not re read the forum rules, the above two paragraphs explain quite clearly why threads can be allowed about cats, not allowed regarding olympic torches, why members may be able to start a sentence with "ER", and why they may also be able to suggest that others are on an alternative universe.

Wakey wakey, the forum is, and always has been a benevolent dictatorship.

The very fact that Paul and the other moderators allow the few here to continue to reinvent the wheel just shows how flexible they are being when it comes to saving the forum.

The last page of discussion has been in the main, reiteration, and smacks of "who shouts loudest", Childhood teaches us that to continually go on about a single issue is far more likely to end up in a negative result.

At least while everyone throws their toys at me they are leaving more sensitive members alone.....

[Robert Darwent]

Originally Posted by Sean Williams

...the above two paragraphs explain quite clearly why threads can be allowed about cats, not allowed regarding olympic torches...

I'd be grateful if you could specifically point out the relevant sections of the forum rules you justed quoted that, "explain quite clearly why threads can be allowed about cats, not allowed regarding olympic torches".

I am having trouble locating them and I believe I'm not the only one.

Regards

[G8HQP Dave]

This thread now seems to be going round in circles.

Most of us accept that the Mods decision is final, even on those occasions when we might wish they had made a different decision. Those who find this hard to accept need to find a forum which better suits them. I support the stand against incoherent ramblings, with appropriate adjustments for those members with particular needs.

Many of us have said we are happy to contribute to keep the site going; there appears to be a preference for voluntary contributions rather than a subscription. Most of us believe that contributors should not be able to exert pressure on the Mods. Those who wish to 'buy' a site should start their own.

I think it may be time to close this thread (at least temporarily), so the mods can have some time to come up with a proposal.

[theoldtrout]

If I may sum up Sean Williams post above. This is Paul Stennings "house" so we should respect his rules.

[Alistair D]

I always remember an adage from my childhood. Listen and learn. Keep it in mind.

Al

[Robert Darwent]

Originally Posted by theoldtrout

This is Paul Stennings "house" so we should respect his rules.

I agree completely. But how can any of us be sure we are correctly respecting those rules when they are applied differently to threads that are all clearly off-topic for this forum.

Regards

[Rejectostat]

When I joined this Forum about 9 years ago I seem to remember all the moderation was done by Paul himself. As the Forum grew bigger and more popular other moderators were engaged.

During the last couple of years there seem to have been regular threads complaining about one aspect or another of perceived excessive moderation (spelling, post/thread deletions et al). It seems also to have been only in the last couple of years that we have heard that the moderator’s are far too busy with the workload. I just wonder if the foregoing problems are related.

I believe Paul and the mod’s are doing a good job the vast majority of the time, and I applaud and thank them for their efforts. Even when I am not in agreement, I acknowledge that the moderators cannot spend ages considering a decision or course of action, and sometimes subsequent events will transpire which suggests another approach would have been more appropriate. I am pleased this thread has been left open, as a potential learning opportunity for us all. It may be decided that things are exactly right as they are, which I am confident will be a decision arrived at after consideration of all contributions to this thread. Alternatively subtle changes in moderation may occur, which general users will not be advised of.

Most importantly, I hope all readers and contributors of this thread stick with the Forum during this little review of Forum operation. I’d like to thank all the contributors across all sections of the Forum for finding time to share their knowledge and experience, and provide such valuable advice and information. Without the contributors, we have nothing here.

[AidanLunn]

Originally Posted by Sean Williams

Er just guessing, the forum has an unwritten agenda that attracts cat owners.

I would also suggest that the selling of Olympic torches would be the next logical step in that thread, so it was kicked out to prevent this happening?

Originally Posted by repairman 1234

Er don't remember asking for your guess
Don't bother posting in direct reply to anything that I post in the future.

Now, now, now, children, no more infighting, please. A pleasant environment harbours pleasant people, so no good will come of arguing and insulting.

Please respect the wishes of other forum members and try and keep this place a calm and civilised, friendly place - no-one else wishes to know if you two have axes to grind with each other.

[petertheorgan]

I am glad that I have got better things to get to excited about that this forum. I have found it very helpful, I have made some very good friends, I have met some fantastic people and have swapped 'junk' with like minded people.

However it is the property and creation of one person, Paul Stenning, and as far as I can see it he is free to do absolutely what he likes. They always say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery and I have had several requests from prominent people on this forum to join the 'competition' which I have been reluctant to do as I feel it would be unfair on the creator of this one.

I would be more that happy to pay a small subscription to help keep it going if that was helpful.

I have to confess that I have been amused by all the feline stories on here and all my friends like the cat photos used as Avatars. One day I will put up a photo of my cat who has the code name of +40+5.

[Richard]

Hi,

Since I started the "Cats" thread maybe I should say something.

I am a member of a few forums, and Yahoo groups, and this is by far the best, and cleanest, with no rubbish, or spam thrown in here and there, dodgy links etc etc, and all this is because it is ruthlessly moderated.

Now let's consider why, there used to be regular discussions about Ebay items, which inevitably turned to criticism of a seller and the prices they wanted for radios, and doubt over the work claimed to have been done etc etc. All this led to Paul (as the forum owner) being threatened with legal action, now consider thing from his side, does he need the agro and hastle, never mind the possible cost of that? Would you take the risk and do all the work needed to run this forum just for the love of your hobby? I know I wouldn't.

Now the "Cats" thread, whilst OT (although the thread was started with pictures of our cats on my valve amplifier) what are the chances of the thread causing offence or someone being sued = very low.
Olympic torch thread, also OT (and not a single valve in sight), and very likely to quickly end up full of opinions, and criticism of people selling the torches, names named, chances of the thread causing offence or someone being sued = very high, so it gets chopped.
Now, how can you write a set of rules to allow for every variation etc etc, you can't, so you adapt as you go.
The forum enables the members to exchange ideas, knowledge etc etc, and is a wealth of information, but at the end of the day it is Paul's, and should he choose too he can "pull the plug".

Now this thread has been allowed to just run, and I think it is a test of us all, can we just get on with each other, give up the excess egos, get over ourselves and just be happy?

Or bitch and whine when a post we made gets chopped, or spelling corrected (we all have spell check) maybe we should get written notice by mail before it happens?
Why not just accept it, it was done for a reason, maybe a bit over zealous but such is life, what does it matter it just a hobby, get over it, I have on a few occasions

I would hate to see this forum go
I would be happy to pay / donate / contribute, £20 or so
Would it bother me if some people did not pay - no
Would it bother me if someone paid £50 - no, good for them
Would I offer to run it, host it - no, I have not got the time

I am going to stop rambling now, but fear we may already have answered the question of does it survive by the bickering in this thread, we have failed the test.

Richard

PS - all above has been spell checked and re-read three times, will it bother me if a spelling mistake or grammatical error is corrected? - no.

[repairman 1234]

Originally Posted by AidanLunn

no-one else wishes to know if you two have axes to grind with each other.

I didn't have an axe to grind until he started the sarcastic comments like ER..., Wakey Wakey, and the one about me living in another Universe