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Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players Open-reel tape recorders, cassette recorders, 8-track players etc.

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Old 8th Oct 2020, 3:03 pm   #1
dougietamson
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Default Baird TR1 restoration begins.

This is my 1st tape recorder restore, it was a loft find and not powered up and as has no mains cable/plug, so made an offer. Weighs a ton, I'm sure most of the weight was the dust/cobwebs and remains of fly larvae There were some tapes with hand written notes about what was recorded, dated 1963.

The mains cable plug and microphone were tucked in the storage compartments on the under side, all fuses were OK. This machine has not been powered up in a long time.

The Mullard valves have 1957 date codes on them, EF86, presumably an ECC83, it has no markings at all, 2 x Mullard EL84, Mullard EZ80 and an EM81.

As for damage, there was general wear and tear, not too bad. There was some broken glass rattling about inside probably from the internal illumination bulb which was missing.

Seems someone had been inside it to add an extra toggle switch for the motor mains supply, this was hacked into the back panel

All original capacitors still in place, the preamp HT smoothing multi capacitor can had spewed forth some of its internals so may explain why it was left in the loft, 32/32/16uF 275v, one of the 32uF was open circuit, surprisingly the other 2 tested ok.

I removed all the valves, the mains transformer tested OK, 320-0-320, heater windings OK too.

The 2 motors ran OK, spent most of the first day cleaning up the tape deck, a few things felt a bit stiff, small amount of grease and it all started moving a lot better.

I'll deal with the dead can capacitor this afternoon, going to try fitting new caps inside the can...

Last edited by Station X; 8th Oct 2020 at 4:20 pm. Reason: Forum rule compliance.
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Old 8th Oct 2020, 7:32 pm   #2
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Here's some photos

The middle 2 are a before and after the can capacitor re-stuff, not done one before.

Doug
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Old 8th Oct 2020, 10:55 pm   #3
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Was it easy to empty the old can before restuffing, I have never done it.

David
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 12:11 am   #4
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Those cans are pretty quick with 10mm diameter flat screen mains cans.
You can get up to four in when re-stuffing a 30mm can by drilling through the bung.
Put a dowel in the first hole to keep the guts still while you drill the other holes.
A small dab of epoxy will stop the new caps falling out again.
Also leaving the can in the chassis avoids leaving tool marks.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 8:01 am   #5
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMcMahon View Post
Was it easy to empty the old can before restuffing, I have never done it.

David
It can get messy... and not 100% sure of the toxicity of the contents I wore vinyl gloves.
I chipped away at the crystallised lump, there was a deep hole under it so I attacked it with some long nose pliers. The rubber was quite perished and came off quite easy. There was a thicker paxolin type layer next with the 3 colour coded terminals (red 16uF, yellow and blue 32uF). I wanted to keep these in good shape to reuse, they pulled out easy too.
The paxolin layer gave more of a fight but I just chipped away at it making sure not to damage the can.
The can was attached with a nice solid steel clamp/ring bracket which was handy for hiding the glue I used to stick a new paxolin disk I made. I used the can as a template to draw round on a sheet of paxolin and cut with a fine coping saw then sanded it smooth. For the terminals I drilled 2 2mm holes and made a small loop of thick solid core copper wire to tie the terminal and flooded with solder. I clamped the negative lead of the new caps to the outside of the can under the bracket.
The plates were in a white paste, it came out in one piece.
I insulated the inside of the can with 2 layers of electrical tape. The caps were hot glued to each other with small blobs leaving space for air flow. I stacked
2 400v 10uF and 6.8uF radial caps in parallel for the 16uF.
I didn't have any paint to put back on the terminals so I just cut some electrical tape into dots and glued to the base of the terminals.

Doug.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 8:18 am   #6
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Refugee View Post
Those cans are pretty quick with 10mm diameter flat screen mains cans.
You can get up to four in when re-stuffing a 30mm can by drilling through the bung.
Put a dowel in the first hole to keep the guts still while you drill the other holes.
A small dab of epoxy will stop the new caps falling out again.
Also leaving the can in the chassis avoids leaving tool marks.
Hi Ref would you like to expand on your method. Some of us old lags might get your meaning but many might not get what a 10mm diameter flat screen mains can is for instance

What kind of drill bit do you use? do you drill a pilot hole.

Cheers

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Old 9th Oct 2020, 8:20 am   #7
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

You did an excellent job, sounds like quite a bit of work though.

For me personally, probably too much work for something that is not normally seen.

David
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 8:37 am   #8
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMcMahon View Post
You did an excellent job, sounds like quite a bit of work though.

For me personally, probably too much work for something that is not normally seen.

David
Very true, the whole preamp board and components on this model are hidden inside its own box chassis.

The waxies are next, I'll just get the best looking axial plastic I can.

Doug.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 8:43 am   #9
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Get rid of those red, yellow, black Plessey electrolytics, they're invariably faulty.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 9:12 am   #10
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

In case you didn't know, that's a Collaro Transcriptor tape deck, probably a Mk4 (the one with the digital tape counter). Huge flywheel. Bi-directional. 2 motors doing the job of 3 - at the expense of extra jockey wheels and links.

The "extra" EL84 elevates (I guess) the electronics to a better class than single EL84 types.
Should be a rewarding restoration.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 9:50 am   #11
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Graham my Magafon 58 has a Collaro Transcriptor tape deck (with a digital tape counter), I see from Collaro adverts that the Mk. 4 came out around 1958, so I assume it is maybe a Mk. 4

So does the Mk. 3 Transcriptor not have a digital tape counter ?

David
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 10:02 am   #12
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by llama View Post
In case you didn't know, that's a Collaro Transcriptor tape deck, probably a Mk4 (the one with the digital tape counter). Huge flywheel. Bi-directional. 2 motors doing the job of 3 - at the expense of extra jockey wheels and links.

The "extra" EL84 elevates (I guess) the electronics to a better class than single EL84 types.
Should be a rewarding restoration.
Graham
I wasn't sure of the exact deck model, any tips on a mechanical service? I've put a very small amount of grease on the many arms/levers/parts that metal rubs against metal. It's now moving a lot better than the original condition it arrived in. I've not touched the motors or gone rear the tape path/heads.

I cleaned the capstan pinch roller, it was quite brown. I removed it and gave it a gentle clean in dilute fairy liquid/old toothbrush. Then some of my home brewed/distilled 96% ethanol (for research use only tho my SAAB 95 is the ethanol/petrol biofuel model so I can keep it running after the apocalypse !)

There was a felt pad inside the roller, I assume for oil, would silicone oil be best here?

Photo of cleaned up roller attached.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 10:07 am   #13
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Anyone know what these things are, 2 of them, one on each side, 2 wires going to a loop of wire?
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 10:16 am   #14
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

There is a good 16 page service manual for the Collaro Transcriptor Mk. 3/Mk. 4 available to purchase/download from the Service Data link in top right corner of screen.

David
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 10:17 am   #15
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

This is a photo of the botch job hole for an added toggle switch, maybe a large washer or small metal plate might be better to mount the switch. I have some thick brass sheet, thin copper sheet and plenty of steel plate that I could use. Looks like a job for the dremel.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 10:20 am   #16
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

I think the coils may be the hum cancellation/compensation coils.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 10:22 am   #17
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMcMahon View Post
There is a good 16 page service manual for the Collaro Transcriptor Mk. 3/Mk. 4 available to purchase/download from the Service Data link in top right corner of screen.

David
Just bought it now, shame there aren't any schematics available tho
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 11:51 am   #18
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobaltblue View Post
Hi Ref would you like to expand on your method. Some of us old lags might get your meaning but many might not get what a 10mm diameter flat screen mains can is for instance

What kind of drill bit do you use? do you drill a pilot hole.

Cheers

Mike T
On the grounds that a picture says 1,000 words I have gone back into my own stock photos for you.
In the after photo you can see that I neglected to put a dowel in the first hole so one capacitor does not go in perfectly.
There is plenty of conductive cooling to the outside of the can.
Before you start you need to check that the old can is deep enough to accommodate the length of the new caps and use some kind of depth gage such as a mark on the drill bit.
Leaving the original can in the chassis means that from the top side it looks totally original with no tool marks on the can.
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 11:59 am   #19
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Here's the valve line up, all Mullard except the one on the far right which has no markings at all.
Date codes are 1957 and 1958, Blackburn factory except the EM81, re-badged Philips made in Holland. This would suggest they are the originals supplied when purchased.

The un-marked one was in the ECC83 socket and looks like the "long plate" version. Mullard made long plates up until 1959. I'll start a thread on the components and circuit forum to try and identify it, who knows, it could be worth 5000 quatloos on the planet Triskelion
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Old 9th Oct 2020, 2:43 pm   #20
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Default Re: Baird TR1 restoration begins.

Thanks to the wise old gits here it has been identified as a Telefunken ECC83.

It has been tried in an audio amp along with the EL84s and makes nice clean sound.

The EZ80 also is working.

I'll have to test the EF86 and EM81 in the tape recorder once I've recapped.
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