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Cabinet and Chassis Restoration and Refinishing For help with cabinet or chassis restoration (non-electrical), please leave a message here. |
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14th Oct 2018, 4:42 pm | #1 |
Hexode
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Cambridge, Cambridgeshire, UK.
Posts: 262
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Philips 634A cabinet help please
The cabinet of my new (old) Philips 634A is mainly in good condition. However the left side is a bit shabby so I would value some advice. The sides and top are made from three pieces of veneered ply. The vertical colour banding seems to be achieved from the tint of the surface lacquer. The veneer is continuous. I have gently cleaned the surfaces with a soft damp cloth using only hand soap for a minimal duration however it was evident that the cloth would have removed more grime had I persisted. I suppose the shabby LHS and top have suffered from daylight damage. But what to do now? I want to retain it's authenticity as much as possible.
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14th Oct 2018, 7:31 pm | #2 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Cottingham, East Yorkshire, UK.
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
The veneer on these cabinets was quite nondescript and presumably the two bands were added to make the cabinet look less ordinary and to give the appearance of contrasting darker veneer bands. This was done by the application of 'toner' before varnishing - most likely with nitrocellulose lacquer and the effect was really quite convincing.
However, many 634As have fallen victim to unskilled restoration by total stripping of the cabinet, which removes the banding. There are some quite appalling examples of 'toffee apple' appearance quite inappropriate to the set. ('It does what it says on the tin' springs to mind). The only was of re-creating the original effect would be to skillfully apply the two bands of toner, then acrylic lacquer as a substitute for nitro-cellulose, and for most of us, despite our best efforts, the result is likely to be disappointing. Personally, if the set was a 'keeper' and I couldn't live with the faded appearance (which - in the antiques trade would be called 'patina'), I'd seek the advice of a professional French polisher. To my mind, the contrasting bands of toner as 'faux veneer' are a distinguishing feature of the set, and if removed, seriously devalues the set, both financially and aesthetically, but that's just my point of view, which others may not concur with.
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14th Oct 2018, 7:42 pm | #3 |
Dekatron
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Location: Rugeley, Staffordshire, UK.
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Re: Philips 634A cabinet help please
I reckon a good application of scratch cover polish would do wonders for that set. Use the light and dark versions as appropriate, being careful to maintain the edge where both colours meet. You really should not have used a damp cloth to clean it as the moisture can have a tendency to get underneath the lacquer through all the cracks in it, be absorbed by the wood and make it's way underneath the lacquer potentially causing it to lift and exacerbate the problem. Anyway, hopefully not if the cloth was not too wet.
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14th Oct 2018, 8:03 pm | #4 |
Heptode
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fenay Bridge, Huddersfield. UK.
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Re: Philips 634A cabinet help please
Hi,
What a lovely cabinet Chris; thanks for posting. I've fully restored many wooden cabinets starting from scratch having completely stripped the original finish but I've not attempted the kind of work you suggest on your cabinet trying to retain its authenticity as much as possible. One thing I did find out to my dismay; I did strip a cabinet with contrasting veneer right back to bare veneer; the veneer was in good condition but was faded so I thought this will be easy and applied a wood stain to the veneers; I expected the darker veneers to show up darker than the lighter coloured veneer but I was hugely disappointed when suddenly all the veneers were the same colour the contrast now lost? Unfortunately the finish on the poor side of yours appears to be damaged right through to the bare veneer plus of course its badly faded. It's highly likely any attempt to restore the poor side is going to show whatever method is used; gently rubbing down with abrasive paper would remove the high ridges and show some improvement but then what finish to apply? French polish (Shellac) could be applied to the whole cabinet building up a decent thickness then cutting back with fine abrasive paper or 0000 wire wool but the cracks in the original finish would only reappear again in a short time. Spraying using rattle cans of clear lacquer could be attempted again building up a decent thickness then cut back but I think eventually the damage would haunt you. Danish oil could be rubbed well in building up thickness but I dislike using Danish Oil on these old cabinets; this isn't an easy or quick problem to resolve; as the cabinet now stands its still original which you say you would like to preserve; a very quick way to show some improvement is to go over the whole cabinet with nothing more than Liquid Paraffin letting it soak for ten minutes then buffing the excess away; Liquid Paraffin is becoming increasingly difficult to find; the last bottles I bought years ago were from Asda Pharmacy only costing about £1 per bottle and one bottle goes a long way. I wish I could offer you an easy solution but I've never liked trying to restore a damaged finish hence you'll see I go back to bare veneer and start over then I know the finish will last; I prefer French Polish but my friend and very highly respected cabinet restorer Gary Tempest prefers using rattle cans of clear acrylic achieving absolutely top class results; I adopted Gary many years ago as my role model to vintage radio restoration when I was a mere novice only aspiring to Gary's exemplary workmanship. If you do decide to strip the original finish then please beware using masking tape for staining to regain the contrast; stain creeps under the masking tape edge when I tried it; I've made just about all the mistakes possible whilst restoring these old cabinets. I think it really comes down to two choices; leave as is or fully strip and restore. Here's a really bad Philco showing even the worst cabinet can be brought back to a decent finish; good luck with yours. Kind regards, Colin. |
14th Oct 2018, 8:14 pm | #5 |
Pentode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire, UK.
Posts: 174
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
You could mask and spirit varnish it using shellac. Either get the tint/tone from using different shellac or add a dye. Being a traditionalist I would tint it with alkanet and/or dragons blood. These along with bleached or garnet shellac will give you a pretty wide range. I use a very soft brush (actually a very cheap blusher brush!) but you can pad it on (French polish). The difficulty will be matching it to the other side but of course the original colour will likely have faded with time.
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14th Oct 2018, 8:59 pm | #6 | |
Nonode
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Worcestershire, UK.
Posts: 2,535
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Re: Philips 634A cabinet help please
Quote:
I think Danish Oil almost always looks 'wrong' from an originality point of view on radio cabinets. I can't at the moment think of any situation in 1930s-on radio cabinet restoration where using wood stain would be a good idea! However, spray-on toner is a different matter... With some experience, full restoration of this cabinet can achieve very good results. After removal of the old finish and careful preparation, you spray on a cellulose stopper coat, do the masking, apply toner where appropriate (and paint in the notched sections) then finally several flatted coats of gloss over-finish. This latter can readily come from acrylic 'rattle' cans. Wet wet 'n dry rubbing down between coats. For the 634A, I never tried to remove the exotic Philips speaker fabric during a restoration, with consequent risk of damage. Instead, this was protected with a close-cut cardboard mask made from cereal packet. Steve |
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14th Oct 2018, 10:02 pm | #7 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Seaford, East Sussex, UK.
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
You would have to strip off the old varnish to french polish and the toner is almost certainly applied in the varnish. It would be impossible to create a sharp edge in french polish as the next coat softens the previous layers.
I have two of these Phillips cabinets to do and have been contemplating buying some cellulose lacquer as it can still be purchased. It's used for vintage cars and guitars. |
14th Oct 2018, 10:46 pm | #8 |
Pentode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire, UK.
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
Careful with NC. The fumes are pretty toxic. You need the equipment.
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14th Oct 2018, 11:21 pm | #9 |
Rest in Peace
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Location: Matlock, Derbyshire, UK.
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Re: Philips 634A cabinet help please
@Retired
Liquid Paraffin is becoming increasingly difficult to find; the last bottles I bought years ago were from Asda Pharmacy only costing about £1 per bottle and one bottle goes a long way. You could try your local vet. Liquid paraffin is used to lubricate the digestive tract. |
14th Oct 2018, 11:42 pm | #10 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Bewdley, Worcestershire, UK.
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
I also have a 634A with the chassis restored and working well, and the cabinet is stripped and ready but still in the 'round tuit' pile. I even bought a stock of Morrell's spray toner aerosols in appropriate colours, but to date I have not had the courage to start. I think that a warm, dry, draught-free environment with controlled ventilation (i.e. a spray booth) is probably essential.
I was toying with the idea of masking off and French polishing using light and dark shellacs instead, but I take PJL's point that it would be tricky. Would it not be possible to (say) mask off with a good-quality non-creep masking tape such as Frog Tape and apply several coats of Button Polish to create the dark bands, then when thoroughly hard, mask over the dark bands and French polish the rest of the cabinet with a lighter colour? I just feel that French polishing is more controllable, and reversible if anything goes wrong.
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15th Oct 2018, 12:31 am | #11 |
Pentode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire, UK.
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
Yes that was my thought of tackling it. You wouldn't necessarily have to 'French polish' the dark band but just straight wipe a 'coat', no oil. Of course it would take a great many applications but it will get there eventually. Brush is a lot faster but with spirit you need a very good soft brush. The only problem I see is getting a crisp line on the masking tape but that may not be a problem at all, it's just something I've never done even though I've decades of experience with polishing and varnishing.
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15th Oct 2018, 8:00 am | #12 |
Banned
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Location: Middlewich, Cheshire, UK. & Winter in the Philippines.
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Re: Philips 634A cabinet help please
E45 ointment is mainly liquid paraffin. Baby oil is similar I believe.
I have used linseed oil on dry cracked veneer with some success. |
15th Oct 2018, 9:25 am | #13 |
Hexode
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Cambridge, Cambridgeshire, UK.
Posts: 262
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
Thank you for all your suggestions. Do you think the use of shellac flakes (which I believe you dissolve in methylated spirits) would give best control of colour or would you suggest a ready made french polish? On Ebay there are several including "Button Shellac Flakes/ French Polish/ Brown/" and another described as "Golden Shellac Flakes, Varnish, French Polish," and of course Rustins. Or should I buy a colour tint as well?
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15th Oct 2018, 9:59 am | #14 |
Nonode
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Aberaeron, Ceredigion, Wales, UK.
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
Hi are you running two threads on same topic ?
Cheers John |
15th Oct 2018, 10:02 am | #15 |
Dekatron
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Location: Rugeley, Staffordshire, UK.
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
Before I did anything drastic like stripping off the finish I would buy two bottles of scratch cover polish in light and dark shades and carefully apply it to respective areas. It's excellent stuff and you may well find the improvement is enough. Otherwise any kind of refinishing is a completely different ball game and will take many, many hours and with this set's two tone colouring, the results may end up looking, dare I say it, amateurish. I'm not casting doubts on your ability BTW, but refinishing such an iconic set so that it doesn't look like it's just been covered in treacle is not always easy, again with that two tone colouring. I've seen some horror stories of refinished 634As. Try scratch cover polish first. If it doesn't work, then go for a 'heavier', more invasive approach.
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15th Oct 2018, 10:06 am | #16 |
Dekatron
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Re: Philips 634A cabinet help please
This thread has been posted twice and I've responded to both of them because I thought the first time had not 'worked'. Can a mod 'amalgamate' all of the responses into one thread?
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A digital radio is the latest thing, but a vintage wireless is forever.. |
15th Oct 2018, 10:29 am | #17 |
Dekatron
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
Spot on Steve,it really is excellent stuff.Used it on many poor looking cabinets.
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15th Oct 2018, 10:42 am | #18 | |
Pentode
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Re: Cabinet restoration (Philips 634A)
Quote:
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15th Oct 2018, 12:40 pm | #19 |
Dekatron
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Re: Philips 634A cabinet help please
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