Problem identifying Sonolor radio

[Wishiknewmore]

Hello
I have just acquired a Sonolor Radio but I am having difficulty identify it accurately after a few hours on the net.
I believe it to be very similar to the Vedette 1952 model but it looks slightly different, in particular my radio has four controls rather than the Vedettes three and I mine has the ”pick up “ option.
The valve line up seems to be 6BE6, 6BA6, 6AT6, 6A5, 6X4 and probably an EM34 (I have not got to that one yet)
I am told by the seller that “it works” but not brave enough to fire it up.
My plan will be to replace the electrolytics and any suspect caps, but need to find a circuit diagram.
Does anyone have any suggestions, ideas or thoughts as how to progress? I am very much a beginner and not overly knowledgeable.
Many thanks
Philip

[Nuvistor]

One possibility, quite a few Sonolor radios on the radio museum web site

http://www.radiomuseum.org/r/sonolor_vedette_2.html

[Wishiknewmore]

Thank you, I ha already seen the Vedette there but its not quite the same 4 v 3 knobs!

Many thanks, Philip.

[Herald1360]

Looks rather like this one:


https://www.doctsf.com/grandlivre/fi...f=28658&ori=ps

[Wishiknewmore]

Thanks Herald 1360
It does indeed look exactly like that one I have, I had been on this site and managed to miss it!
It does however present me with a conundrum as the valve line up seems different to mine, the valves on mine seem to match the Vedette (Not sure about the magic eye one as mine is no longer marked)
Either way still cant find a circuit diagram

Philip

[Nuvistor]

Is the valve 6A5 or 6AQ5? Probably 6AQ5.

You have the valve types so can get the data and connections of those.

Perhaps you could manage without a circuit, hopefully capacitors and resistors will have there values printed on them. Alignment may be more of a problem but if it's not been messed around with that should not be far off.

Frank

[Herald1360]

Apart from details round the coil switching (which hopefully you won't need) pretty much all French radio chassis of the era are very similar, often with an eclectic mix of B7G, B9A and octal bottles. If you can download a circuit from one with the same valves as yours it'll be close enough to edit fairly easily into what you actually have.


I sometimes think just about every radio dealer in rural France produced their own variation on the same theme, there's so many "modeles inconnus" about.

[Wishiknewmore]

Frank
The valve is indeed a 6AQ5 I shall download the info on the valves
Chris
I was of the same mind and to that effect I have been on the DOCTSF French site and there were 32 radios with the same line up and going by the pictures very similar chassis, but would you believe none had a circuit available! Either that or my French is so bad I have misunderstood the site
The site gives e-mail addresses of those that have uploaded the pictures and general info on some models so I will have a go at asking the question ..wish my language skills were better
In the meantime my plan is to sort out which caps to replace, but I will have some questions about some of the components --will sort some pictures out shortly
Thank you and wish me luck!
Philip
Ps this one the chassis looks identical, but its described as a 4 tube.
https://doctsf.com/grandlivre/fiche.php?ref=16254

[Nuvistor]

The SSL certificate on that page returns "cannot be identified " may be nothing but proceed with caution.
Frank

[Herald1360]

I suspect that's just because the uploader was thinking only of the radio circuit valves and discounting the rectifier and magic eye.


The common 5-valve superhet is also described as a 4+R, so perhaps by extension the Sonolor Etoile is a 4+R+ME.......

Cristal-Grandin Serenade 635 uses the same valve lineup and has a circuit Here:

http://85.144.220.212/nvhr/CristalGrandin_634.pdf

Spookily enough the coil/switch unit is just shown as a block.

[Wishiknewmore]

Frank
This is the url from the address bar may be better/ safer?
https://www.doctsf.com/grandlivre/fi...icher_photos=0
Philip

[Wishiknewmore]

Chris
Thank you that is wonderful, the chassis layout looks about the same as well.
I am afraid this will lead me on to more questions!!
Philip

[Wishiknewmore]

Need help about which capacitors to change, below I have a list and a picture of the underside of the chassis
My plan forward would be to replace the electrolytics marked A B and C with values as close as can reasonably get to the existing, I THINK that cap "I" is “that” capacitor but by no means sure
I was told it was a working set, but as yet I have not made any attempt to power up, ( I will do this via a dim lamp set up), so I am really looking for guidance as what to sensibly replace and what, if any, other caps to buy on the same order as contingency (I have very very little in terms of stock of components as this is all new to me!)
I have also added what I believe cap values are based on what is marked on them, please comment if you think I have got it/them wrong
Thanks in advance
Philip

[Nuvistor]

From the photo OMNKP will probably be ok, they look like Mica types.
ABC may be serviceable, try and reform them, find instructions on the forum with a search, AB may be unobtainable and you may need to replace them with standard types or restuff the original if faulty, again sesrch forum for details.
Not sure about D, don't know what type it is.

The others look like wax paper types, probably find they are electrically leaky and require replacement.

Worth another opinion before starting.

Frank

[Herald1360]

D looks like a wax/paper type and from its position on the mains transformer I suspect it's across the AC supply. If so it should be replaced by a similar capacity X-class capacitor. If it goes to chassis it should be a Y-class part.

X and Y are specs for AC mains rated capacitors; X for use between live parts (neutral is classed as live) and Y for use between live parts and any accessible conducting part where its failure could conceivably result in a shock hazard.

At least there's plenty of room under there to get at everything, unlike some sets!

[Wishiknewmore]

Frank

Reforming sounds scary to the uninitiated, was happier with the thought of replacing the large cap A+B under the chassis while leaving it physically on the top ...but sorting polarity is a slight concern yet to be tackled

Chris
Having taken a closer look and even closer photograph it looks like cap "d" is between live and the chassis, so does that make it a Y type ?
On a quick search I can find X2 plentiful and cheap but y type much less so
At the risk of being naive could I use an X2 across the mains supply instead?

Thank you for your patience
Philip

[Herald1360]

Y types are less readily available, particularly in any value over about 4.7nF, since the leakage current through them starts getting closer to detectable/dangerous as the capacitance rises.


In practice, an X type is probably at least as safe as the original, but it's not regarded as safe in that position nowadays. If the set works fine with that capacitor left out, just do that. Otherwise fit the largest value Y type you can find that's </= the original cap's value.

Of course X2 across the mains could be added anyway.

Edit: something like this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10nF-300V-...RnEMIpX0Rvm8GQ

[Nuvistor]

A+B capacitor, fitting new under the chassis and leaving the original disconnected but still in place is perfectly acceptable.

Frank

[Wishiknewmore]

Capacitor voltages?
I am starting the (long) process of ordering my replacement caps and need to know how absolute the values need to be eg some are rated 2000v ans some 1500v would 1500v
apply to all in that range? as with 550/500/450v
First example om my list:-

Is 450v 15uf a suitable replacement for the 16uf 550v in this radio
http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/alumin...itors/5262310/

Guidance please
Philip

[Ed_Dinning]

Hi Philip, not sure what the circuit is, but generally the 450v is not a good replacement for the original 550v rating. 15 or 16uf is matter less.

Another approach would be to put lower volt caps in series, so the 16uF 550v could be replaced with 2, 30uF (-ish) 300 or 350v caps. Each cap should have a 470K resistor across it to equalise voltages.

Have you made up a lamp limiter yet for the first power up?

Ed