Whatever happened to...

[quantum]

Does anybody remember (or even possess) an Advance 86 computer? As I remember it, it was an attempt by WH Smith to catch on to the early PC craze, these machines being sold through WH Smith's computer departments. Although designed by Advance Technology UK the machines were actually built by Ferranti. Using a 8086 chip these were supposedly true IBM compatibles - were they really or could they just run a version of MS-DOS? Whatever happened to WH Smug's attempt to be a computer supplier?

I remember in the early to mid '80s friends who had machines that ran a version of MS-DOS (always seemed to be version 2.11 for some reason) moaning that if they tried to run software for the IBM PC (such as Lotus 123) their machines would often lock up! The CAL PCs I've mentioned in another could use a version of MS-DOS 2.11 but couldn't run any stuff designed for the IBM which had any graphics above text characters involved - so it could run MS Basic and Cobol but not GW Basic or Lotus.

[AC/HL]

Ive never come across WH Smith computers, but I once had a Ferranti 8086 which was IBM compatible. It ran DOS 3.2 (from memory). A relatively powerful program like Lotus 123, which was designed to run on DOS 3.X could possibly have problems with an earlier version of DOS. Also IBM DOS, although compatible with MS DOS is not necessarily identical. To further complicate matters, not all BIOSs are born equal. All in all, It must have needed more skill in the days before Windows to have been an IT Engineer.

[jim_beacon]

I had an Olivetti PC1 as my first PC, it ran DOS 3, from a single floppy drive, and (I think) 512Kb of RAM. I had a good combined package that ran well on the machine, and produced my wifes teaching notes for 12 months.

The machine was reasonably compatible with the IBM, though it was extremely fussy about the floppy drives you used - I never did get a second one to work!

It was hooked up to a Daisy wheel electronic typewriter to print (the first of the cheap ones, typewriter was about £50, and the RS232 interface about another £15). This produced high qaulity results from a fairly low cost set up.

Another almost ccompatible was the Apricot, which had the same processor, drives, monitor specs etc, but a different memory map, so there was no chance of swapping software between the Apricot and the IBM.

Jim.

[quantum]

I think that the Advance 86 was released circa 1984, so that would predate versions of DOS 3xx, and I think that the maximum amount of ram it came with was 256k.

I also had an Apricot Xi for a time, and as Jim says it had the same problems with compatibility with the IBM standard. I could transfer programs over from my Amstrad 1512, but only if they had text graphics or no graphics would they work. So, MS Basic and Wordstar 3, Supercalc 2 and Dbase II would be fine, but forget GW Basic, Wordstar 4, Supercalc 3 etc..! I had the same problems and successes with the CAL PCs I've mentioned in another thread, so perhaps the different memory maps in early DOS compatible PCs were mainly concerned with how the machines handled graphics?

[evingar]

Did anyone come across a Newbury Labs machine ? I remember them being produced locally, but never had one. I think, from memory the brand name was Newbear but I may be wrong.

[Jeremy M0RVB]

Did anyone come across a Newbury Labs machine ? I remember them being produced locally, but never had one. I think, from memory the brand name was Newbear but I may be wrong.

Were they the same company?

I had a Newbear 6800 single board computer (6800, some ram, some LEDs and switches). This came as a kit from a shop in Liverpool, when such shops were rare.

We also used Newbury Labs kit at work, specifically VDUs. These things had a vast single board filled with discreet chips, a chunky keyboard, and battleship-grade construction.

there was a series of computers called the newbrain by grundy see http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=176 proper vintage computing

[Jeremy M0RVB]

Useful website ref - thanks. Yes I remember that one, a friend had one. Nowt like the Newbear which was a board and no case (or display, keyboard, ...)

Anyone remember the Nascom I and II, which later became the Gemini range of boards?

[ppppenguin]

I remember the Nascom 2. When I worked for Michael Cox Electronics in the early 1980s we used them to drive a prototype vision mixer. Programming in assembler, bulk storage on cassette tape. Worked well.

[AC/HL]

Some years ago I did a short contract in Saudi Arabia. Amongst the kit we installed were Pye touch screen (light pen) controllers. They used a version of the Acorn BBC computer to control them. I can't remember the maker's name off hand.

[jim_beacon]

Another almost compatable was the Apollo Domain 3500, which used a lot of PC type cards, but not an x86 series processor - I believe it was a Motorola based machine. We had a couple at college as CAD machines, and still have a few at work, but I don't know a lot about them.

Jim.

[JohnBoy]

I Have an Advance 86 at the back on a cupboard. Not many people know that the hardware was designed by Robert Madge, who later went on to found Madge Networks, the Token Ring company.
I wonder if anyone would want to buy it, if so how much is something like this worth. On the other hand I could probably do with the cupboard space so is there a museum somewhere which would like this relic of the Breat British Micro era.

[mickjjo]

This online museum have the details of the Advance 86, they may be able to find a good home for yours. .

http://www.old-computers.com/museum/...asp?st=1&c=507

Regards, Mick.

[coredump]

The Advance 86 was indeed made by Ferranti and sold by WH Smiths. We had one at the office in London in about 1986 to evaluate. Huge, bulky thing with deeply recessed serial and parallel port connectors on the back. Which meant that we couldn't physically fit the plugs into the sockets! Bit of a design blunder...

But the thing the Advance 86 is famous for is that it used the IBM PC BIOS verbatim, without any changes or modifications. At the time, it was legally uncertain whether copyright law could be applied to firmware. Well, it was, and Ferranti lost. Meanwhile, the other clone makers were re-engineering BIOS code by a method that became known as "clean-room technique". Again, legally challenged in court but this time IBM lost.

[Belrond]

Originally Posted by jim_beacon

I had an Olivetti PC1 as my first PC, it ran DOS 3, from a single floppy drive, and (I think) 512Kb of RAM. I had a good combined package that ran well on the machine, and produced my wifes teaching notes for 12 months.

Hi That remined me of my Olivetti PC1 double disk drive bought cheep from Dixon
It was suppose to take over from the Spectrum 48k but it was a wierd beast which forced me to join the PC1 usergroup and only then did it become half way useful, but the thought of buying an IBM would have been too much.
Like most of the kit aquired still hidden in cupboards along with about 20 usergroup 3.5 disks.
John

[RobinBirch]

We had an advance 86 XT equivalent at work. IIRC the processor sat on a small mother board with really ropy connections.

Newbear were a seperate mob who produced hobbyist stuff. I have, somewhere, a tape recorder interface that they made for a homebuild computer known as a Triton.

I had for a while several Newbury Labs monitors which I used on CP/M machines. They were very good, a bit huge,, but very easy to use and fairly reliable.

The one system that I am sorry didn't last was a unix box called a Whitechaple which was very good and quite cheap for the time. It got sunk by the likes of Sun and Apollo but we had a couple we gave to a University for research work.

Robin

[infilms]

Originally Posted by evingar

Did anyone come across a Newbury Labs machine ? I remember them being produced locally, but never had one. I think, from memory the brand name was Newbear but I may be wrong.

Yes I had one of these - I bought it in 1980 I think and remember collecting the kit from the manufacturer in Newbury. I've started an entry about the 77/68 at Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newbear_77/68) and will shortly be donating my machine to the Museum of Computing @ Swindon (http://www.digitalhistory.org.uk/history_museum.php).

I'm intrigued to get in touch with anyone else who had one of these

[evingar]

Originally Posted by infilms

Yes I had one of these - I bought it in 1980 I think and remember collecting the kit from the manufacturer in Newbury. I've started an entry about the 77/68 at Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newbear_77/68) and will shortly be donating my machine to the Museum of Computing @ Swindon (http://www.digitalhistory.org.uk/history_museum.php).

I'm intrigued to get in touch with anyone else who had one of these

Welcome Infilms

I read your Wikipedia entry with interest - you are absolutely correct, there was something special about building your own circuitry from scratch and getting it to do “things”. Admittedly slightly later than the New Bear, I built a small uP circuit on patch card using the “all new” 6502 processor. I made the memory map the same as the BBC B so that I could easily assemble programs on that machine and load them into my uP to use it for dedicated tasks. Manually entering the Hex code on a Data IO keypad to get it into an EPROM was a pretty tedious and error prone task though!

I'll ask around to see if I can unearth anyone around here that owned a Newbear .