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Components and Circuits For discussions about component types, alternatives and availability, circuit configurations and modifications etc. Discussions here should be of a general nature and not about specific sets.

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Old 30th Aug 2019, 11:28 pm   #81
stuarth
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Default Re: Amazing D cell discovery!

Ion or iron? - there are 3 different categories of lithium cells in common use.

Lithium ion cells (3.7v) are rechargeable, and used in laptops, phones, power tools, Tesla cars and Boeing 787s.

Lithium Manganese cells (3.3v) are commonly the button cells (eg CR2032) used in many low power electronic devices.

Lithium Iron cells Li/Fe (1.5v) are sold as alternatives to Alkaline cells in, amongst others, AA and AAA sizes. They can give much better run times than Alkalines at high currents (c/10 or more) but similar run times at low currents.

Stuart

Only the Lithium ion cells are rechargeable.

Stuart
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Old 31st Aug 2019, 8:54 am   #82
Mooly
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Default Re: Amazing D cell discovery!

My lithium cells were normal AA replacements, nominally 1.5 volts but significantly higher than that off load, just over 1.8V from memory.

These lasted longest in the very low drain clock in my one off experiment. The mouse, which is still 'low drain' in the big scheme of things proved disappointing and here the lithium gave only a 50% improvement over alkaline.
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Old 1st Sep 2019, 2:37 pm   #83
Hampus
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Default Re: Amazing D cell discovery!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maarten View Post
Especially given that they're zinc carbon. Are they 'Made in Belgium'?
Yes they are. It seems that batteries still are made there, hopefully of the same high quality. Maybe I should buy a couple of them and wait 28 years...
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Old 2nd Sep 2019, 1:44 pm   #84
Maarten
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Default Re: Amazing D cell discovery!

Panasonic Energy Belgium now only makes alkaline cells, one of the largest factories in the world. Zinc carbon are now made in Poland. Don't know about the quality, could still be decent. The factory is in Belgium because it started out as a joint venture with Philips.
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Old 12th Sep 2019, 10:23 am   #85
Mooly
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Default Re: Amazing D cell discovery!

Seeing as this is the current battery thread

I did a bit of looking at the Panasonic and Kodak sites as these brands are readily obtainable at the likes of Poundland and Homebargains... and I had got curious over anecdotal and objective evidence regarding alkaline vs zinc/zinc chloride etc. The Panasonic batteries apparently are Zinc Carbon and not chloride:

https://www.panasonic-batteries.com/...zinc-batteries

https://www.panasonic-batteries.com/en/zinc/zinc-carbon

whilst Kodak's are zinc chloride. The Kodak batteries have detailed data sheets available and show a 1050mAh vs 2700mAh for zinc vs alkaline, albeit with a significant internal impedance difference of 2 ohm vs 0.15 ohm. Both discharged to 0.8 volt into 75 ohm.

I'd also never heard of Kodak premium alkaline's (never see those in Poundland) and these have 3000 mAh capacity at 0.1 ohm impedance.

The overall consensus from the manufacturers is that the Zinc's are the preferred choice for clocks and remotes etc. I'm currently using Kodak zinc chlorides in my HP mouse and I'll be interested to see how they compare to the alkalines which typically last 5 to 6 months.
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Old 14th Oct 2019, 8:40 pm   #86
Mooly
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Default Re: Amazing D cell discovery!

A bit off topic bit I'm just updating this for completeness... and although not 100% scientific the result should be in the right ballpark.

So, the HP mouse which consistently runs for 5 to 6 months on alkaline cells (Sony/Kodak etc) has run for 48 days using the Kodak 'Super Heavy Duty Zinc' cells from Poundland. I mentioned Zinc Chloride in the above post but these actually do say just Zinc.

A pack of eleven cells cost 1 and so these worked out at approx 0.09 each or 0.018 for the pair needed as against the 0.50 per pair for the Alkalines and so the Alkaline did just about win out on overall cost.

The zinc cells operated down to approx 1.15 V in the mouse and had a short circuit current of around 220 milliamps. Placed in a Mag-light and they couldn't even get a glimmer from the filament.
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