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Old 18th Jun 2017, 12:39 am   #441
Reelman
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Call me mad but I would love to have a band 1/3 aerial on my chimney. If anyone spotted it I'd just say that was to go with the old telly! I'd have it aimed at Emley Moor so I could use it for DAB if not TV.
Peter
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Old 18th Jun 2017, 10:06 am   #442
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

405 was switched off in 1985, does any one know if Band 1/3 aerials were still being made in the early 80's?

With being close to Winter Hill, we only ever fitted UHF aerials from around 1970, if the VHF aerial was damaged any 405 only sets were 7 or 8 years old and customers wanted new sets, any dual standard sets we left working the 3 stations on a new UHF aerial. It helped with the UHF signal being strong and reliable.

Frank
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Old 18th Jun 2017, 6:14 pm   #443
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

BI and III aerials would have continued being made on the continent. Antiference did a couple of combined BI and III aerials for export for example. The MH308 I think it might have been looked similar to the combined B1 and III types used in many areas during the 405-line days.

Last edited by Focus Diode; 18th Jun 2017 at 6:20 pm.
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Old 18th Jun 2017, 7:32 pm   #444
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Thanks for the info, I left the trade in 1980 so lost touch.
Frank
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Old 19th Jun 2017, 12:47 pm   #445
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Frank,

Premier Aerials (Cheltenham) Ltd were still making Band I and Band III aerials for quite a few years after 1980. I think there was a residual demand in the hillier regions of Wales for them. I was told that when they stopped making them a few pallet loads went to the skip-in-the-sky. The company also sold Antiference and J. Beam stuff in their shop.

Antiference has kept producing Band III designs, first as Focus_diode says, for export and more recently for DAB. But apart from the specific model for the Irish Republic's Maghera transmitter (whose analogue transmissions were originally on channel IB, horiz and channel IH, vert ) I don't think they produced any Band I designs in the 1980s.
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Old 19th Jun 2017, 1:05 pm   #446
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Steve,
All interesting info, the only poor reception area I had to deal with was Parbold, not far from Winter Hill but completely screened. Even there though, 405 didnt last long because a repeater station was built to provide 3 channel UHF coverage.

Appreciate DAB are broadband band 3 aerials in disguise.

Frank
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Old 19th Jun 2017, 1:12 pm   #447
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Frank,

"DAB is Band III in disguise" Indeed so; to be exact Antiference sold a 4 element, Band III (using a folded dipole) aerial covering CCIR channels E5 to E12 for use with DAB. The same element lengths are employed for their present design - except that a trumatch dipole is used instead.
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Old 20th Jun 2017, 12:46 pm   #448
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Re post no. 441:

Peter - you'll just have to go and find a friendly aerial rigger. I suspect there are still one or two Band I/III aerials to be cleared off the skyline (unfortunately).
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Old 21st Jun 2017, 8:40 pm   #449
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

I have asked one or two riggers before, but as the old aerials are fairly rare I think they forget by the time they find one. Also due to the size of a band 1/3 it is probably easier to break them down during removal. I must remind the last chap we used, he won't forget us due to the amount of work we got him to do!
Thanks for the suggestion anyway.
Peter
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Old 21st Jun 2017, 9:02 pm   #450
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Nice one! Why don't you knock on the door and ask them if they still have the telly that was connected to the other end of it. John.
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Old 22nd Jun 2017, 3:15 pm   #451
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Peter,

... the real problem with them is corrosion. After all these years, especially if they have been in an industrial area - or next to the sea (salt corrosion) - then they are as likely to crumble in your hands as do anything else.

Best Make - J. Beam (Al alloy nuts and bolts), shame about the junction box cable seals.

Reasonable make Antiference (especially the Antex 'X' types - very good junction box in my experience).

Worst makes - a whole plethora of 'cheap and cheerful' types that are usually in too poor a state to do much with.

Of course, any 'loft finds' are to be snapped up !
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Old 22nd Jun 2017, 7:38 pm   #452
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Managed to stop the lorry and take this one adjacent to Billingshurst station West Sussex. It's in remarkably good condition lined up with the Chillerton Down and Rowridge transmitters. [11 & 3]. There are others in the area but impossible to stop to take pictures with a large vehicle. John.
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Old 23rd Jun 2017, 12:47 pm   #453
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Heatercathodeshort,
Re post no. 452:

A nice picture - you've had me straining to work out whose make of aerial it is! (possibly Antiference, if the dipole holder is lozenge shaped - I can't tell from my screen view)

Any thoughts on where all the H. Pol UHF aerials are pointing?
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Old 23rd Jun 2017, 6:51 pm   #454
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

I guess that two are heading for Midhurst. Not sure about the other. John.
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Old 24th Jun 2017, 2:33 pm   #455
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

John,

Thanks for the zoom-in. I am pretty confident that your pic is of an Antiference HiLo design, model number HL207. It is a 7 element channelised Band III (6 directors and a 'resonator') on the same boom as a director - dipole channelised Band I 'H'. The downlead is just connected to the Band I dipole (through a hole in the boom), the dipole holder being attached to the boom by two 'U' bolts.

As an aside the channels in question, B3 to Rowridge and B11 to Chillerton Down both near each other on the IoW, were also used in East Anglia, B3 Tacolneston, B11 Mendlesham, where the polarization was horizontal. Not a problem for this design, except that the transmitters were not at all co-located, so this is an aerial you do not see often in EA. To give an idea of the actual size of the aerial, bear in mind that Antiference usually used a standard 12 inch director element spacing for most of the elements in its Band III aerials irrespective of channel (but the element lengths were channelised).

Last edited by SteveCG; 24th Jun 2017 at 2:34 pm. Reason: layout
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Old 24th Jun 2017, 6:20 pm   #456
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reelman View Post
Call me mad but I would love to have a band 1/3 aerial on my chimney.
Maybe Peter but at least there are two of us. Not on my actual house roof but it looks nice on the garage roof. I think it is a 'TELERECTION' but it is a while since I erected it so may be wrong. It is fully functional and picks up traffic interference from the A29.

It was removed from a farmers club at Rudgwick about 5 miles away in West Sussex/Surrey border. It was again lined up with the I.O.W.

The wire on the left is the 'wireless aerial'.
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Old 24th Jun 2017, 6:45 pm   #457
Reelman
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heatercathodeshort View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reelman View Post
Call me mad but I would love to have a band 1/3 aerial on my chimney.
Maybe Peter but at least there are two of us. Not on my actual house roof but it looks nice on the garage roof. I think
It looks very good John, I'm glad someone else has fitted one even without the benefit of transmissions to go with it.

Thanks to all for their suggestions.

Peter
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Old 26th Jun 2017, 1:19 pm   #458
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Re post no. 456:

John,

That is indeed a Telerection Aerial. I'm pleased it is still functional as corrosion at the screw-in element holder in the Band I dipole junction box usually makes them just a 'Cosmetic' display these days. BTW: It is a director-dipole Band I 'X' design.
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Old 26th Jun 2017, 6:55 pm   #459
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

I see our new ship is all ready for the return of Band 1 transmissions too!

Peter
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Old 27th Jun 2017, 1:07 pm   #460
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Peter,

"Affording perfect reception of Ally Pally at a range of 120 (nautical) miles ??"
I trust the Wardroom has a well-adjusted Pye 915 installed. Spare EF50 valves for it can be obtained from the Radar Room...
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