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Old 10th Mar 2015, 8:17 pm   #241
Chris-G8ETC
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

A nice idea but when not using one of my old MW/LW radios, I listen to stations being streamed over the internet using an old surplus smartphone.

Chris
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Old 10th Mar 2015, 10:26 pm   #242
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicklyons2 View Post
Well you could bring the Band III one back into use because it is probably going to be pretty good for DAB. You could 'optimise' it a bit by shortening the rods but I would think, pointed in the right direction, it will be so much better than a room telescopic aerial even at its present dimensions.
I have heard that there will be band 1 allocations for DAB+ in the future. So you never know that band1 aerial may well be pushed back into service again.
In the meantime we may see 405 line tv transmitted from Alexandra Palace when this aerial of yours will come into its own.
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Old 10th Mar 2015, 10:38 pm   #243
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

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Originally Posted by Nicklyons2 View Post
Well you could bring the Band III one back into use because it is probably going to be pretty good for DAB. You could 'optimise' it a bit by shortening the rods but I would think, pointed in the right direction, it will be so much better than a room telescopic aerial even at its present dimensions.
I considered pushing a note to that effect through the door of a nearby property but the occupant might think "Who is this weirdo who spies on people's rooftops and then pushes a note through their door?".
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Old 10th Mar 2015, 11:02 pm   #244
Chris-G8ETC
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

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Originally Posted by Hybrid tellies View Post
In the meantime we may see 405 line tv transmitted from Alexandra Palace when this aerial of yours will come into its own.
Yes please, bring it on.....



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Old 13th Apr 2015, 1:22 am   #245
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

I spotted these surviving 405 line aerials recently, apologies for the poor quality. They were taken in difficult conditions using my phone's camera.

The first picture is at Ilkeston (Derbys), with the aerial probably pointing at Belmont. The UHF aerials will be aimed at Waltham.

The second picture is taken at Matlock (Derbys). I've been walking past this spot for years and never noticed the aerials. They look to be a bit of a DIY installation and are pointing south, so towards Lichfield/Sutton Coldfield.
Matlock has several surviving 405 aerials, mostly along the same stretch of road. I'll have to photograph these as well.

The last picture is at Sutton in Ashfield (Notts) This aerial would be pointing at Belmont as are two of the three UHF aerials.

Michael.
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Old 15th Apr 2015, 11:09 pm   #246
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Aidan's photo in post 222 of Peter Pennington's TV shop shows a good range of receiving aerials and charts the history of TV from 405 lines up to current digital satellite. There's even a BSB Squarial bolted to the side of the building.

The shop will have seen many changes. Presumably the upstairs space would have been the repair workshop.

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Old 27th Apr 2015, 5:31 pm   #247
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Great photos there Michael. Many thanks for uploading them.

Caught this once common combined Ch5/8 aerial in Winlaton, Gateshead earlier today. The vertically polarised UHF aerial is for the Fenham relay.
On first seeing the aerial it looks as if one of the BI dipoles had broken off through age. When I saw it later it appears to have been removed on originally mounting it as it would've got in the way of the roof!
On second thoughts perhaps it was removed when moved down from the top of the pole to make way for the UHF aerial. There's also a lower UHF aerial directed for Pontop Pike.

Cheers,
Brian
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Old 11th Jul 2015, 5:09 pm   #248
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Thought I'd revive this thread, as I saw several such aerials on a recent visit to Maidenhead. These are just a few of the many I saw.

Most, if not all, were pointing towards Crystal Palace.
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Old 11th Jul 2015, 5:09 pm   #249
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

And a couple more.
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Old 24th Jul 2015, 4:29 pm   #250
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

I've been taking these photos for a while and saving them, so its about time I up loaded them to this thread!

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They are all in Worcester city centre which his quite low lying. Getting a signal from Sutton over the high ground to the NE of the city clearly needed a good antenna. There seems to be examples of antennas for just about every broadcast band on these two buildings. The UHF arrays are aimed at Malvern. Does anyone know what the wooden board was for? Could it have been the support for an early wire radio antenna?

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Old 24th Jul 2015, 4:53 pm   #251
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Here are a few more antenna picture from around my area.

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The first photo was taken in Upton-upon-Severn. This is another low lying location and clearly need a good antenna for Sutton. There does'nt seem to be any band 1 antenna.

The second picture was taken in Tenbury Wells. This array is pointing at Sutton.

The last two are on top of buildings in the centre of Ledbury, not far from the old market building. They are both pointing to the SW. I guess with the Malverns and the Ledbury Hills in the way Sutton was no go from here. The UHF array seems to be pointing to the south, not towards Ridge Hill which is only a few miles away. It may just be a bit off the correct heading, but could it have been aimed at the Mendip transmitter?

Steve
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Old 24th Jul 2015, 5:40 pm   #252
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

This last group of pictures are of antennas in places out of my local area.

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The first antenna is in George Street, Oxford. Assuming that the small UHF array is facing the local Oxford transmiter, the VHF array is facing NW towards the Birmingham transmiters.

The second antenna is in Mumbles, near Swansea. The simple band 1 diople would have received a good signal from the Wenvoe transmitter across Swansea Bay. The UHF array, presumably also for Wenvoe, is pointing skywards and the feeder doesn't seem to be doing very much!

The third picture is of an antenna on a building in Helmsley market square. The UHF array is pointing at the Bilsdale Moor transmitter, not far NW of here. The VHF array is therefore pointing towards the SW. Would this have been Emley Moor? The "take off" from here is very good to the south.

The last two pictures were taken in Pickering. Again the UHF arrays are looking at Bilsdale Moor with the VHF systems probably facing Emley moor with the same good take off as in Helmsley.

Steve.
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Old 24th Jul 2015, 9:16 pm   #253
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

The George Street (Oxford) one is apparently on what used to be the Welsh Pony pub. A candidate for an elaborate aerial array, I suppose.

Thanks for posting it.
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Old 25th Jul 2015, 11:37 am   #254
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Re post no. 252

Can I suggest that if the impressive Belling & Lee double 9 is pointing to Lichfield, then the remnants of the Band I aerial is in the opposite direction (note where the junction box is and the Band II 'twigs')?

They're all interesting pics !
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Old 25th Jul 2015, 12:06 pm   #255
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Re post no. 251,

The Ledbury aerials: I recognise them !

As for the (J. Beam MBM) aerial, well both Wenvoe (an early TX) and, slightly later, Mendip aerials are to be seen in the locality. Also a few Sutton Coldfield in spite of the terrain. However as you (rightly) imply, the opening of Ridge Hill on UHF swept the board. There were only a few Channel B6 aerials for Ridge Hill 405 line ITA in this part of the world, most were either B8 (Lichfield) or B10 (St Hilary) 'turnarounds'.

Last edited by SteveCG; 25th Jul 2015 at 12:08 pm. Reason: clarification
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Old 27th Jul 2015, 10:00 pm   #256
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Thanks for the comments on the antenna pictures.

I don't know Oxford well, so I had no idea what the building was, thanks Nick.

Ok on the VHF array Steve. I noticed that the booms aren't exectly parrallel, but didn't spot that it was facing the other way! I supose that would mean that it was directed at the London transmitters. I wonder why they didn't use London for the ITV signals? Maybe they prefered the Midlands programming.

I spotted a few more antennas in Hereford while driving through the city the other day. I'll try to get some pictures next time I'm over that way.

Best wishes,

Steve
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Old 27th Jul 2015, 10:37 pm   #257
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Quote:
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I don't know Oxford well, so I had no idea what the building was, thanks Nick.
I know Oxford and its architecture quite well, Steve, but had no idea that aerial was up there until you pointed it out, so thanks to you too
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Old 27th Jul 2015, 10:46 pm   #258
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Oxford still has quite a few VHF installations surviving. ITV reception was always very difficult with signals coming all the way from Croydon or Lichfield (not CP or SC, they were BBC transmitters) so there were some impressive rigs in use. Even where the aerials have been removed the very substantial poles remain in place with a tiny UHF aerial perched on top.

The remnant of the band I aerial on the Welsh Pony (now the Eurobar) is probably for AP or CP.

Despite the 'posh southern' image, Oxford is culturally a Midlands town. When the Beckley UHF transmitter was opened it was allocated to ATV and later Central.
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Old 28th Jul 2015, 8:44 am   #259
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

I know Oxford fairly well, but didn't know that the 405 line aerial array was still atop the old 'Welsh Pony' pub, which has a different name these days, I believe.
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Old 28th Jul 2015, 9:17 am   #260
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Here's a rather poor "Google Street View" grab showing a combined BI/III antenna at the southern end of Mansfield Road (where it joins Holywell Street). I suspect it's pointing at London, though I'd have thought it should be vertically polarised?

The 'swept back' B1 element is particularly attractive though I doubt it does anything to improve directivity.
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