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Other Vintage Household Electrical or Electromechanical Items For discussions about other vintage (over 25 years old) electrical and electromechanical household items. See the sticky thread for details. |
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7th Aug 2020, 2:40 pm | #1 |
Hexode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Grove Park, SE London
Posts: 382
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Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
Hello there, I have a Singer 201k sewing machine that needs a rewire. The motor is an external belt driven type that isn't earthed and having looked at the plug, the neutral is a yellow wire and live is red??
Anyway, I found a US diagram for rewiring and was wondering if you guys could have a look and see if its ok? It does differ slightly from the original wiring... https://images.app.goo.gl/Pjv2e5UiXqCxX4Ci6 |
7th Aug 2020, 3:05 pm | #2 |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 27,957
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Re: Rewiring a singer sewing machine
Yes, the image is correct. There are 3 connections - neutral, which is common, live, which goes to the lamp, and rheostat, which goes to the motor.
Don't bother about the colour coding, which may have been changed anyway. Just use a meter or continuity checker to confirm which wire or plug pin is which. There is no way to earth the system with this arrangement. You may want to use the machine through a plug in RCD and/or connect an improvised earth to the metalwork. If you don't earth it you may feel a very faint tingle. Remember to change the suppression caps in the pedal if that hasn't been done already. |
7th Aug 2020, 3:19 pm | #3 |
Octode
Join Date: May 2017
Location: St Austell, Cornwall, UK.
Posts: 1,018
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Re: Rewiring a singer sewing machine
I have the exact same Singer with the same external Motor.
One of the best Machines they ever made. Mine still works like new. I can't tell you if it is correct or not, I can only tell you how mine is wired, and Touch Wood, I haven't been electrocuted yet. To avoid confusion, everything is referenced to looking at the PLUG face on, on the Machine itself. NOT the socket on the cable. Left most Pin is Neutral Middle Pin is the Foot Control input & Right most Pin is Live. Which, as far as I can tell, is what the diagram you linked to is saying. How does this differ from your original wiring? Although, I have never opened the Motor, so don't know if there were any differences to the internal wiring. But I have double and Triple checked my Cable and Socket in response to your Post. I'm not an electrician myself, so if in any doubt, please consult a qualified electrician. Ian |
7th Aug 2020, 3:34 pm | #4 |
Hexode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Grove Park, SE London
Posts: 382
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Re: Rewiring a singer sewing machine
Thats amazing, thanks! I wonder why mine differed slightly? Either way I will follow this.
I pulled out the suppressor caps from the pedal as they caused the motor to run on its own! Do they need to be replaced? I read somewhere just to forget them, but others do indeed replace them. What are the best ones to use? |
7th Aug 2020, 3:36 pm | #5 |
Hexode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Grove Park, SE London
Posts: 382
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Re: Rewiring a singer sewing machine
Hi ian, so instead of live going to the pedal, its neutral which contradicts the diagram... I can take a photo later if you like?
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7th Aug 2020, 3:49 pm | #6 |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
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Re: Rewiring a singer sewing machine
The pedal will work without the caps, but your next door neighbours won't be very pleased if they listen to AM radio. You can replace them with ordinary X2 caps. The values aren't critical.
I agree with Ian, the 201 was Singer's top of the range domestic machine for the 30 years after 1934. If they are maintained properly they'll last forever. Although a domestic machine, they remain popular with professional tailors and dressmakers to this day. It doesn't actually matter if you swap the live and neutral connections, as both are (or at least, should be) completely isolated. Always use an RCD for safety, either in your house consumer unit or as a plug in adaptor. |
7th Aug 2020, 4:17 pm | #7 |
Octode
Join Date: May 2017
Location: St Austell, Cornwall, UK.
Posts: 1,018
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Re: Rewiring a singer sewing machine
Ref Post #5
Not quite sure what you mean ? The direct Live (Right most pin) feed is only for the Light. The Middle Pin is from the Foot Control and provides power to the Motor via the Rheostat (Speed Control). The Left most Neutral Pin is the Return for both the above. As far as I can tell, my description is exactly the same as the Diagram you linked too. The Cable and Foot control is manufactured in such a way, that the Mains Plug is at one end, the Foot Control is at the other end and the Socket for connecting to the Singer is in the middle. A clever use of a single Two Core cable, since there is no Earth connection. Ian Last edited by Superscope; 7th Aug 2020 at 4:28 pm. |
7th Aug 2020, 4:29 pm | #8 |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 27,957
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Re: Rewiring a singer sewing machine
Ian is correct.
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7th Aug 2020, 11:02 pm | #9 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Staffordshire Moorlands, UK.
Posts: 5,273
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
My mum's (it was her mothers) 201K has a double insulated motor, just as well as the instruction manual shows a lady plugging it into a ceiling lamp. It also has weird cable core colours, the original flex has a rather loose, shiny outer covering
__________________
Kevin |
8th Aug 2020, 12:24 am | #10 |
Hexode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Grove Park, SE London
Posts: 382
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
So based on your agreements that the circuit looked ok, I made the arrangement in image 1. Its more or less the same as it was before. Does it look ok?
Also attached are images of my motor leads. I had to resolder some as the old wires were fragile and crumbling. I will be adding a shrink wrap and some insulation tape aswell of course. I Wasnt sure if I used the right kind of wire. I had it lying around but figured that as the motor is 0.3 amps and of course UK voltage, it would be ok. Do you think I should do the same to the other side? Or leave it? Thanks! |
8th Aug 2020, 10:44 am | #11 |
Octode
Join Date: May 2017
Location: St Austell, Cornwall, UK.
Posts: 1,018
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
Hi,
Yes your Socket certainly looks correct, provided of course you took the Photo with the Left most mating connector on the left side of the Photo, which I assume you have. I can't comment on the internal wiring of the Motor as I have never had to have mine opened, but I can't see a problem with what you have done. Being an AC Motor and double insulated, I can't think of any implications even if the wires got swapped. Regarding the Cable used, I would have thought any lighting Flex would have been suitable, which is what you have used by the looks of it, but I'm sure there are some electricians on here who could/would advise otherwise if it were necessary. I am still curious though, you mentioned the wiring was slightly different on your Machine, but never explained how it was different? Has somebody attempted to re-wire it before? Did the Machine work before your re-wiring? Ian |
8th Aug 2020, 1:31 pm | #12 |
Hexode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Grove Park, SE London
Posts: 382
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
Hi, yes. So if you look at the way it is wired, instead of the foot pedal (right hand wire) connecting to the right most wire with the live wire from the plug, it was connected to the left connection and to the neutral wire fron the plug. If that makes sense?
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8th Aug 2020, 2:11 pm | #13 |
Hexode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Grove Park, SE London
Posts: 382
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
Although I have never rewired it myself or know of that happening, I did notice that the neutral wire was yellow rather than standard black and the live was red as usual. Potential evidence of rewiring?
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8th Aug 2020, 2:30 pm | #14 |
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
Double insulation means just that, two layers of insulation twixt mains and metalwork, both must be (these days anyway) good enough on their own. If it was mine I would make sure any repairs hold to this i.e. two bits of heatshrink. At least then (if it comes to it) you can say and demonstrate you have done a good job. If I was doing this for someone else I would add an earth to the motor frame, for myself I wouldn't bother.
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8th Aug 2020, 3:11 pm | #15 | |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 27,957
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
Quote:
It sounds as if you may be getting confused about this. If you're in any doubt, ask for advice from a sewing machine technician or an electrician. |
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9th Aug 2020, 1:12 pm | #16 |
Hexode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Grove Park, SE London
Posts: 382
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
Having studied the diagram, I'm quite confident that it is correct. My main question now is if i rewire those old wires in the motor! Still waiting for that shrink wrap!
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30th Aug 2020, 11:45 pm | #17 |
Hexode
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Grove Park, SE London
Posts: 382
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
Hello all, sorry I haven't been in touch! I have rewired the motor and seems to be functioning fine and no longer smoking!
As the wire is thicker than the old one, I was wondering if anyone has any advice on what type of grommet to get for the wire? Someone also mentioned a kind of earthing that I could do. How would I best do that? |
31st Aug 2020, 10:34 am | #18 |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 27,957
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
There is no particularly elegant way to earth the metalwork, as the control pedal wiring has no support for an earth connection. I don't bother and rely on an RCD unit. You would need to connect one end of an earth wire to the metalwork with a screw or croc clip, and the other end to the earth pin of a plug.
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31st Aug 2020, 12:27 pm | #19 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK.
Posts: 5,345
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
The wire colours may have been based on US practice, where Line is black and Neutral is white.
The instruction manual for the motor-cum- light for mum's 15K Singer took great pains to explain in some detail how, when replacing the bulb (SBC base), you had to push it in and twist. Possibly necessary for domestic users in the US and most other countries who were probably only familiar with screw-based bulbs, but hardly necessary for 1950's Britain where users would only have experienced bayonet-based mains bulbs. I remember that the lengthy explanation confused mum when she first read it! Last edited by emeritus; 31st Aug 2020 at 12:34 pm. Reason: Typos |
31st Aug 2020, 12:58 pm | #20 |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 27,957
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Re: Rewiring a Singer sewing machine
There were some differences between the US models and the Kilbowie (K) models. The Kilbowie factory in Glasgow was absolutely huge.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singer...er_in_Scotland |