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Old 9th Jun 2010, 5:08 pm   #1
Ed_Dinning
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Default Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

Hi Gents, I'm not sure if anyone has seen this advertised, but I would be interested to know how accurate it is. It is about a raid to northern France in 1942 to"discover the secrets of Germany's radar supremeacy"

I was lead to understand that the invention of the cavity magnetron had put the UK a long way ahead of the axis powers in the radar field.

Any comments?

Ed
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Old 9th Jun 2010, 6:29 pm   #2
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Default Re: Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

If your interested in the fine details I can recommend "A Radar History Of World War II, Technical & Military Imperatives" by Louis Brown. It's been a while since I read it, but both Germany & Japan produced radar sets. A Russian scientist even made a magnetron but before he could develope it he was sent to siberia!.

At the start of the war Britain was desperate for radar as defense was a priority. The Germans being on the offensive saw little need for it. As the war moved on the Germans increasingly needed defensive radar. By the end of the war German radar systems were arguably better than allied one's, very well engineered. However they could not produce them in the quantities required, unlike the Americans. After the war many German radar sets were given to universities etc. It was one of these that first measured the distance between earth & the moon! Later developed in to radar mapping.
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Old 9th Jun 2010, 7:07 pm   #3
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Default Re: Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed_Dinning View Post
Hi Gents, I'm not sure if anyone has seen this advertised, but I would be interested to know how accurate it is. It is about a raid to northern France in 1942 to"discover the secrets of Germany's radar supremeacy"

I was lead to understand that the invention of the cavity magnetron had put the UK a long way ahead of the axis powers in the radar field.

Any comments?

Ed
There was a successful raid on a Wurzburg radar installation at Bruneval in February 1942.

Furthermore, as part of the famous raid on Dieppe later that year, a small detachment was sent to raid a Freya radar station. Jack Nissen, the radar engineer involved (and one of only two survivors of the party), gives a graphic personal account of this in his interesting book "Winning the Radar War". (ISBN 0-7090-3731-7)
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Old 9th Jun 2010, 7:56 pm   #4
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Default Re: Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

'Instruments of Darkness' by Alfred Price is a good read on this sort of stuff as is my well-thumbed copy of Most Secret War by RV Jones.
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Old 9th Jun 2010, 9:33 pm   #5
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Default Re: Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

Saw this first time around Ed. Not a lot of Radio/Radar explanation really. Very matter of fact narrator with a grenade, "1003 bang!" Nice shot of an AR88 in Service. Last year there was a lot of reference to the "Secret War" series from the mid seventies on here and I was thinking "how did I miss that at the time?". Must look for it on the web. During an EL Railway "Wartime Weekend" in Ramsbottom a month or so later I spotted, apart from a very attractive young "WAAF" member, part two of the video series. The next day in another charity shop window, waving at me as I passed, P1. Seemed a strange coincidence on all levels! These are the episodes that cover war time Radio/Radar and feature RV Jones, who comes across as such a modest chap and Brian Inglis lookalike! Clearly he was the one that was right from the beginning. His "superior" tried to put him down but was overuled by Churchill in the end, fortunately for the rest us. I think some of that SW footage has been used in this CH5 program [and the one about Coventry last year as well].

Dave W
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Old 9th Jun 2010, 10:04 pm   #6
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Default Re: Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

From what I recall from reading RV Jones, one of the puzzles early on was how and why the Germans had such accurate stable oscillators for their radar and navigation beams. I think it turned out that the stability came from excellent mechanical engineering, which exceeded the actual requirements of the particular use. Our side were scratching their heads wondering what they were up to, but it turned out to be simply their normal engineering - not some fiendish new invention.
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Old 9th Jun 2010, 10:18 pm   #7
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Default Re: Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

Hello there, 'Green Beach' by James Leasor.This is a true story 19 August 1942, the story of a chap* that went to have a look at ----------- I am not going to spoil it for you but it was so important that he would have been shot if there was any chance of him falling into enemy hands.
* Jack Maurice Nissenthall.

Get a copy if you can if not PM me.
Cheers.
Geoff.
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Old 9th Jun 2010, 10:41 pm   #8
Sean Williams
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Default Re: Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

Ed,

Have a nose around for Dr Philip Judkins - I am fairly sure he will be able to give you a well reasoned and authorative answer - this is an area of expertise (I know he reads the odd post here now and again.....)

Cheers
Sean
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Old 9th Jun 2010, 11:02 pm   #9
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Default Re: Radar Beam Raiders-C5 7-30 wed 9 june

I think it was RV Jones in his book "Most Secret War" who said that the accuracy of timing and frequency in German radar sets was actually used against them. They were so much more stable than allied sets that this effectively identified them as hostile, so that they could be targetted.
Another good read is "The Radar Army: winning the war of the airwaves" by Reg Batt.

TTFN
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