The Audiophoolery Thread.

[GrimJosef]

Originally Posted by merlinmaxwell

... Most plugs have the fuse vertical err ummm ...

Maybe the instructions are aimed at people who are not vertical ?

Cheers,

GJ

[Argus25]

Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler

Patented = I do wonder just what aspect is actually patented. In this sort of thing it's unlikely to be what they want you to think it is. Patent officers have to be very literal.

David

I'm pretty sure I read an article some time back about a new device that was patented. It had rotational inertia, kinetic energy storage, gyroscopic properties that lent itself to navigation applications. It was restrained by a "pleurality of radially spaced fixation devices" and the whole thing had perfect rotational symmetry. Passed by the patent inspectors and was assigned a patent. It was a wheel.

Also I have seen a patents, where the data provided by the inventor, graphs etc, demonstrated that the device was ineffective at its intended task, but none of the patent inspectors detected that.

When I asked a patent lawyer about this sort of thing the response I got (made sense) was:

"A patent is not a scientific document, its a legal one"

[Radio Wrangler]

Ah, the light begins to dawn.

We've been doing it wrong all these years mounting sockets with the earth at the top. The earth should be to the side so the power connections (and the fuse) can be horizontal, so there are no dips for worn-out electrons to pool in. This is why those speaker wire supports produce such an audible improvement.

David

[dglcomp]

Now weren't there some rewireable plugs with horizontal fuses, an easy wire type perhaps then if so we just need to buy up supplies of said plugs with the horizontal fuses and sell them as special horizontal fuse plugs designed specifically for horizontal fuses, think of the markup!

[knobtwiddler]

Originally Posted by Outrun_uk

https://www.russandrews.com/signature-socket/

Oh, come on! Really?? This sort of thing should be against the law ��

The ASA thought it was! But he got the judgement overturned on appeal: https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/russ-andrews-accessories-ltd-a13-228690.html

I was told he used to have a trick, whereby he connected one of his fancy mains IEC leads to a kitchen radio to show the improvement. The story went that the radio had a very crude unregulated PSU,.which gave just enough voltage for a passable volume. The stock IEC cable was knobbled with a resistor. When the phool lead was plugged in, voila! A couple of extra dB! This story is heresay and I repeat it here with the disclaimer that I shall delete the post if his lawyer gets uppity -)

[emeritus]

An interesting assertion in the bumf about the signature socket regarding the superiority of Rhodium plating:

"Rhodium may not be the most conductive metal, that honour goes to silver. However, Rhodium is an exceptional hard and tough metal making it perfect for environments where fit and forget performance is crucial. The conductivity performance of rhodium remains constant over its lifetime, unlike gold and silver which will deteriorate over time due to oxidisation."

It might be true that Silver can oxidise ( although I thought that the oxide remained conductive), but Gold?

[Craig Sawyers]

Originally Posted by knobtwiddler

The ASA thought it was! But he got the judgement overturned on appeal: https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/russ-andrews-accessories-ltd-a13-228690.html

I was told he used to have a trick, whereby he connected one of his fancy mains IEC leads to a kitchen radio to show the improvement. The story went that the radio had a very crude unregulated PSU,.which gave just enough voltage for a passable volume. The stock IEC cable was knobbled with a resistor. When the phool lead was plugged in, voila! A couple of extra dB! This story is heresay and I repeat it here with the disclaimer that I shall delete the post if his lawyer gets uppity -)

I know Russ and his small 12 person team up in Kendal pretty well. And they are all honourable, straight-up people. There is absolutely no way that Russ would get up to that sort of shenanigans.

Also, I was responsible for getting the ASA ruling overturned after a full day of emissions and immunity tests at 3C Test at Silverstone http://www.3ctest.co.uk/ . Faced with hard evidence, the ASA withdrew their ruling.

[Radio Wrangler]

And that is the important point. Arguments have to be strictly fair, honest and accurate.

A cable CAN be made that better rejects incoming or outgoing radio frequency energy, both conducted and radiated compared to a simple cable. It isn't even difficult to do, and the performance can be measured compared to the simple design of cable. These sorts of cables, at least of one sort of enhancement, are very common. A lot of cables provided with computer equipment have overmoulded ferrite sleeves on them to act as common-mode high frequency absorbers. These things work, and such equipment usually needs them in order to pass the RFI tests applied to new equipment. Fancy cable construction can also help with differential mode unwanted signals. So I'm not surprised that a fully accredited test house can measure a difference, and thus an advertisement can be written around hard facts which can be independently verified.

The one cable supplied with computers without a common mode choke on it, is the mains cable. This one gets away with it because RF filtering, both common made and differential mode is performed inside the PSU. But if you open a PC PSU you'll often find that the filter components in many are not loaded and common mode chokes are replaced with wire links bridging them out. It looks like some manufacturers may fit them to get an EMC pass, and then not fit them in production units to save money. EMC tests on such shipped products do throw up some fails.

Computers aren't hifi amplifiers. Does hifi need fancy cables or external filters?

Not if it's designed well.

Is hifi equipment designed well?

Some, but not all.

The equipment ought to have a few quid's worth of components inside it along with some care over layout. What it shouldn't need is several hundred pounds spent on fancy cable.

Russ Andrews' advert quite correctly proved defensible. But the value of the product is in putting a sticking plaster on the symptoms of corner cutting/cost saving (or incompetence) elsewhere.

I'd rather tackle problems at the source.

David

[stevehertz]

Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler

And that is the important point. Arguments have to be strictly fair, honest and accurate.

..... But the value of the product is in putting a sticking plaster on the symptoms of corner cutting/cost saving (or incompetence) elsewhere.

I'd rather tackle problems at the source.

David

Well, you say that - and I agree entirely - but it is in the nature of an audiophool to believe that each and every component in the source to sound chain can be improved to enhance the sound quality. Yes, in some cases there is a measurable difference - more often than not, not one of much significance - but can it be heard or identified in ABX testing? Time and time again audiophools fall into the trap of fitting new components (cables etc) and, knowing that they are now listening to a few hundred pounds worth of 'improvements', proclaim how much better the sound is using the old favourite phrases like "the soundstage is greatly improved", "a veil has been lifted", "every instrument is now clearly identifiable", "the bass is firmer", "the highs less harsh" etc etc and bringing in 'flavour of the year' words like quantum, spectrum, and so on.

Oh, and just searching for audiofile favourite phrases, I came upon this list of crackers on the Home theatre forum. What fun:

"Pulling harmonics together from a jumbled auditory stream to form a coherent harmonic envelope."

"Image outlines were sharply focused in space with believable palpability."

"There was plenty of bass detail to behold."

"The music flows with gusto and verve. It squeezes instrumental images into incredibly palpable outlines."

"...more muscle and definition, and a heart that is pure gold."

"Most preamps when pushed hard change their sonic signature."

"Harmonic colors were somewhat on the dark side."

"By using the $450 gold plated RCA stereo jumper cables for all line-level connections, and the newly available $1200 gold plated XYZ speaker wires, we were able to achieve a distinct improvement in highs and the deepest rich bass lows I have ever heard. A massive improvement over ordinary old copper."

"These cables deliver big time! The sound is surprsingly smooth and spacious, with particularly sweet upper octaves."

"If you connect a ground to the chassis of your power amplifer and use 4 gauge wire connected to a bucket of salt water with a copper coil in it, your mids and highs will be the sweetest you have ever heard. Works with car audio systems too. Place the bucket in the trunk and reduce speed on corners and when braking, to avoid spillage."

"Special wooden resonator disks made in Asia from a special tree, only found in one area. Placing these under EACH of your components, at strategic locations will remove 'unwanted resonances', and DRAMATIC improval tonal quality. The difference is astounding. These disks of wood sell for around $100 to $400 EACH (depending on size)."

"somewhat fuzzy portrayal of image outlines."

"Harmonic textures ebbed and flowed with startling dynamic nuances and the sort of liquidity and purity one only comes to associate with world-class audio products."

"Harmonic textures are painted slightly gray in color."

"Spatial detail was painted with a fine brush that readily resolved massed voices and the air around individual instruments."

"Image outlines, however, are more precisely focused within the soundstage and in general the Accordance is capable of sketching out a convincing 3-D acoustic impression."

"It felt like I had crawled into a warm and inviting sonic womb."

"Not content with straight S.E.X. (the single-ended experimenter's kit), the Doctor introduces the "69" tapered pipe loudspeaker. Sounds like a recipe for a mind-blowing sonic orgasm."

"The impression of speed and control was strong."

"Bass lines were fleshed out with excellent definition."

"It is less lush sounding than..."

"...force feeding the listener an earful of detail; more accurately, a barrage of in-your-face zingers that becomes almost an instant irritant."

"Each tube brand seems to have a unique flavor of its own."

"Certain busy passages of music get congested."

"... sounds either euphonic or bright."

"The Equilibre ($8,475) - nominally a 60-watt stereo amp."

"It could well explain the sweet sounds that come from using passive preamps straight into the power amplifiers."

"...with an easy-to-drive impedance magnitude."

"Rendition of harmonic colors was suave and smooth, with a believable sugar coating."

"Exposure of low-level detail, even in complex passages, without leaving anything to the imagination."

"The mids are vivid in spades with wave after wave of honey-coated harmonic bliss."

"The midbass region is "fun"

"the upper mids are a bit more laid back than I would like."

"the low bottom end is not there..."

[knobtwiddler]

Excellent post, David. I can think of no worse insult to an audio PSU's design integrity than to suggest it needs some kind of external filtering. It is paradoxical to think that someone with the knowledge to understand how a cable which reduces conducted interference works would buy an amplifier or similar that was deficient in this regard in the first place.

[stevehertz]

Originally Posted by Craig Sawyers

I know Russ and his small 12 person team up in Kendal pretty well. And they are all honourable, straight-up people. There is absolutely no way that Russ would get up to that sort of shenanigans.

Also, I was responsible for getting the ASA ruling overturned after a full day of emissions and immunity tests at 3C Test at Silverstone http://www.3ctest.co.uk/ . Faced with hard evidence, the ASA withdrew their ruling.

And very often, so are fortune tellers. To have a belief in something that is to many others, crazy, is not against the law. But it can and often does encompass a very grey area where money can be made.

[knobtwiddler]

Many years ago, I tried acupuncture to help me kick smoking. I sat in silence for 40 minutes, inhaling vapours from various herbs, with the needles in place. I dare say, had I listened to my hifi immediately afterwards, it would have sounded great!

[Craig Sawyers]

Hey guys - you know from this thread precisely how strongly I feel about hyperbolic nonsense from equipment manufacturers.

However, the question arose about the integrity of Russ Andrews in particular, and by extension the tiny company that is Russ Andrews Accessories. The question was also asked about the ASA ruling and its overturn.

All I was doing was setting the record straight.

I am most certainly not changing my very vocal opposition to ridiculous claims, usually it has to be said by US companies, regarding their outrageous and outrageously priced products that have not one jot of credibility. I will fight on this front tooth and nail.

So give it a rest guys - I'm on your side after all!

Which goes to show, if you are going to take someone to court/ASA get you own facts right first.

[AC/HL]

Originally Posted by knobtwiddler

I can think of no worse insult to an audio PSU's design integrity than to suggest it needs some kind of external filtering.

But where's the fun in that. Buy a perfect system...then what, sit around just listening to music, when you could be saving for the next elusive grail. Works at all levels from Dansettes up.

[G4YVM David]

Twenty five quid for a single 10 amp fuse.
I'm in the wrong business by a wide margin. Are some.peoplelooking for a way to.lose their money? Twenty five quid.

Originally Posted by m0cemdave

Towards the bottom of the page is this:

--------

Frequently asked questions.

Q: Are fuses directional?

A: Yes, fuses are directional. Electricity should flow from the left to the right when you view the fuse. If you do not know

the direction of flow you should listen to the fuse inserted in both directions. One direction will sound more detailed. This is the correct way.

--------

I wonder if that entire website (there isn't much of it anyway) is a spoof?

[GrimJosef]

Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler

... Computers aren't hifi amplifiers. Does hifi need fancy cables or external filters? ...

These days almost everything seems to have a microprocessor or three in it and there can be boxes in a hi-fi rack which are more 'computer' than anything else. I've been to hi-fi events where there are no musical sources in the room at all. Everything that's been played has been streamed from a cloud server somewhere.

Cheers,

GJ

[Malcolm G6ANZ]

Apparently the 'blue fuses' have a burn in period. Surely a fuse that has burn in is open.

[julie_m]

The "burn-in period" is probably to allow your wallet to recover from the sudden creation of a partial vacuum, while your mind's ear finds some subtle improvement that it must have made!

[knobtwiddler]

Originally Posted by julie_m

The "burn-in period" is probably to allow your wallet to recover from the sudden creation of a partial vacuum, while your mind's ear finds some subtle improvement that it must have made!

Beautifully articulated!