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Vintage Television and Video Vintage television and video equipment, programmes, VCRs etc.

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Old 5th Aug 2022, 7:38 am   #1
toshiba tony
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Default Confusion! VCR or VTR?

Who can put me right please, due to dementia this simple query is baffling me, I always thought the term VCR was owned by Philips, and officially they were VTR's. Yet TV's were marked VCR on the channel selectors, no TV's spring to mind that had them marked as VTR (Video Tape Recorder).
To most people this might sound so trivial but for someone trapped in their little world it's big, thanks anyone.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 7:46 am   #2
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Default Re: confusion!

I think you're correct in saying that VCR was a trademark of Philips. For sure it was used on their 1500 and 1700 series of video recorders. But isn't it a bit like Biro or Hoover, whereby the name became commonly used to describe similar equipment? VCR meaning Video Cassette Recorder of course.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 7:48 am   #3
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Default Re: confusion!

It might be that any domestic VCR format dictated the TV used also switched the line sync circuit to a reduced time constant to speed up lock and reduce jitter.

This would not have been a problem with open reel or U-matic pro formats.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 7:48 am   #4
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Default Re: confusion!

I don't think anyone owned the term 'VCR'. It's just short for Video Cassette Recorder. VTR was more commonly used for professional Video Tape Recorder which were the big reel to reel video recorders used in studios etc.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 8:12 am   #5
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

According to Wikipedia, yes I know, Philips named their system “Video Cassette Recording”for the N1500 type units but other manufacturers were using “Video Cassette Recorder” before that.
Agree VTR were open reel and professional types.

Probably meanings merged over time.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 8:28 am   #6
toshiba tony
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

Thanks all, especially Frank, yes, open reel recorders were tended to be called "VTR", my next topic of boredom will appear shortly, sat down all day certainly gives you time to contemplate odd things, thanks again, Tony W.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 8:48 am   #7
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

As far as I remember the term "videotape" was registered by Ampex back in the mid /late 1950's. This name was given to their first broadcast 2" Quadruplex VTR the VR1000. I'm pleased to say that I both operated and maintained one of these 300 + valve machines (VR1000B) for some years. Manufactured in 1959, I still have it's maintenance / circuits manual.

Last edited by Amtec123; 5th Aug 2022 at 8:53 am.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 9:26 am   #8
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

I have no idea if ‘VCR’ was trademarked anywhere, but it was certainly a commonly used term on equipment and brochures back in the day. Also ‘VideoPlus’ the TV listings timer system was called ‘VCRPlus’ in North America, so I very much doubt it was trademarked there.

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Old 5th Aug 2022, 11:13 am   #9
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

Philips went on to call the V2000 system VCC (video compact cassette). No-one wanted to copy that...
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 1:04 pm   #10
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Welsh Anorak View Post
Philips went on to call the V2000 system VCC (video compact cassette). No-one wanted to copy that...
To be honest I think lots of terms seemed to become interchangeable over time. However I think VCC was used more to describe the cassette rather than the machine. I remember on the training course, the tutor describing the VR2020 as 'A VCR using the Philips VCC system'.....they loved their abbreviations!

Oddly I never referred to my VR2023 as a VCR. If asked if I had a VCR, I referred to it as a Video 2000.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 1:21 pm   #11
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

In North America VHS tapes and machines were called VCRs, or at least that's what they were called on films and TV series.
Perhaps VCR was seen as a more generic, and less commercial brand than VHS, particularly outside Europe.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 2:27 pm   #12
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

According to Wikipedia VCR is an analogue recording format that was designed by Philips. So unless you don't believe Wikipedia, then that's pretty conclusive. As I say above, the acronym 'VCR' was often used as a general one for video recorders, similar to the way that 'biro' and 'hoover' are used. But it's Philips'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_Cassette_Recording
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 2:30 pm   #13
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

I don't remember the term "VCR" ever being used in the UK back in the day. The common term for a video recorder was just "video" as in "the burglars stole the telly, the video and all my jewellery."

The term "VCR" seems to be something of a retronym, at least in the UK.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 3:10 pm   #14
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

The USA used to, and I think still does, have strict marking requirements for patents and trade marks, so if you do not positively say that something is a trade mark by using "TM" ( for an unregistered trade mark) , "RTM" ( for a registered trade mark), or use the R in a circle symbol, then you risk losing any protection you might have had.
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 3:46 pm   #15
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

For me if it used a cassette it was a VCR. I never had to deal with reel to reel videotape...

Videoplus should be written as VideoPlus+ because it's a service/trademark, like TalkTalk or PlusNet..
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Old 5th Aug 2022, 4:43 pm   #16
George Cooper
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

Just to add to any confusion out there with VCR, VTR etc may I point out that there is also the VCR, Video Cartridge Recorder, Panasonic made loads of them for the semi pro market (Education), NV-5120 and similar for those who might like to check then out. Another American company also made a cartridge recorder I.V.C (International Video Corporation).

The cartridge operated with a stiff leader tape which self threaded itself onto a spool built into the machine, the Panasonic version worked very well and I worked with many. The I.V.C. Machine was dreadful and broke more often than it worked from what I recall, we had a few in on demo but we decided in a few days that they were not worth bothering about. The I.V.C. Machine preceded the Panasonic machine by a good few years so perhaps Panasonic sorted out the problems.

With both machines the cartridge tape could be removed from the cartridge housing and played on an open reel machine (or vice versa), I.V.C. had there own format (which on open reel produced near broadcast results from it's 1” tape. The Panasonic version was slightly better than VHS and conformed to the EIAJ format which means that it could be played on many different makes if it was an EIAJ format.

The big disadvantage of the cartridge format was that you had to fully rewind the tape to remove it from the machine, the big advantage of the cartridge format was that you had to fully rewind the tape to remove it from the machine, which meant that it was ready to play the next time. In education this was so useful as with cassette formats no one rewound the tape ready for the next time.

There may be others but these are the only ones I ever worked with. I do recall that Hitachi had a cartridge machine but it was (I think) a Panasonic.
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Old 7th Aug 2022, 12:24 pm   #17
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehertz View Post
According to Wikipedia VCR is an analogue recording format that was designed by Philips. So unless you don't believe Wikipedia, then that's pretty conclusive. As I say above, the acronym 'VCR' was often used as a general one for video recorders, similar to the way that 'biro' and 'hoover' are used. But it's Philips'.
Philips itself didn't even agree with Wikipedia, so the exact meaning of the acronym and the percieved order of ascribed meanings might not be fully accurate.

Early VCC recorders actually had the VCR logo on them (I think a double mirrored logo to represent the new cassette), suggesting a more generic meaning instead of only referring to a particular system.

Come to think of it, VCC was never really the name of the system, only of the cassette. The 2000 name might have been a happy little accident, since it natuarally followed the 1000-1100-1200-1400-1500-1700 sequence of earlier recorders (despite being spread over 3 numbering systems).
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Old 7th Aug 2022, 12:38 pm   #18
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

The most obvious case relating to sequences of initials was World Wildlife Fund suing WWF (world wrestling federation). Things have got more stupid since then, with Red Bull trying to intimidate Bullards Cider, which makes one yearn for the times when companies just shrugged their shoulders and got on with life...if anyone did register 'VCR' it was highly optimistic!

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Old 7th Aug 2022, 1:12 pm   #19
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

It seems that an Australian magazine has a nice article on the history of video tape. Some references here:

https://thegreatbear.co.uk/video-tap...ette-recorder/
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Old 7th Aug 2022, 1:23 pm   #20
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Default Re: Confusion! VCR or VTR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Philpott View Post
The most obvious case relating to sequences of initials was World Wildlife Fund suing WWF (world wrestling federation). Things have got more stupid since then, with Red Bull trying to intimidate Bullards Cider, which makes one yearn for the times when companies just shrugged their shoulders and got on with life...if anyone did register 'VCR' it was highly optimistic!

Dave
Then there was this end-cap shown on some American TV series, including in the UK.
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