Best way to clean old vinyl records?

[AC/HL]

And they left a tell tale mark on the turntable.

[ajgriff]

Originally Posted by Ted Kendall

... Indeed, low-compliance pickups can put enough energy into the vinyl that it rattles around the disc and returns as delayed multiple echoes. Maybe this is part of the highly-prized sound of moving-coil pickups?

Now there's a contentious issue that is definitely beyond the scope of this thread!

Alan

[tracypaper]

I have watched a youtube video and the guy used WD40? I used it to get the sticky tape residue off a Beatles pictures disc and it worked amazingly, washed after with washing up liquid and sponge to remove the WD40, its now hanging in the twins music room as a clock.
But as mentioned above I swear by Record Restorer with built in anti static.
Gaz.

[Bruce]

Just musing on comments in this thread, particularly those by Josh Ward, and reflecting on my own humble efforts at record cleaning in the past, carried out over the kitchen sink using a weak fairy liquid solution and 2" paintbrush with the bristles cut short and so a little stiff, with the record (label carefully protected) washed under copious amounts of running tap water (in those days I lived in a location with particularly soft water). Perhaps one secret to a successful outcome, regardless of the cleaning machine used, is the use of enough water to float the muck out of the grooves and off the record, rather than just moving it to a different location.

Would it be too heretical to suggest that the core of the success of cleaning machines such as that constructed by Agriff, and other similar styles of record cleaner, is due not solely to the use of suction to remove debris, but to the fact that the very design of the cleaning machine involves the use of a fair amount of water and thereby the grit is flushed away rather than just being moved about- the suction supply yet another level of cleaning/clean-up here.

Bruce

[Electronpusher0]

Originally Posted by AC/HL

And they left a tell tale mark on the turntable.

Not just a mark, at least two otherwise decent decks I have picked up at car boot sales have neat circles of lifted paint and rust where someone has licked the sucker and stuck a dust bug on the deck, neatly trapping a film of water under the sucker.

Peter

[Ted Kendall]

Originally Posted by ajgriff

Now there's a contentious issue that is definitely beyond the scope of this thread!

Alan

OT, maybe, but the contention is eased by direct appeal to experiment, as John Crabbe did - no flat-earther he. Take a turntable with two pickup arms. Place a high compliance cartridge in one and a low-compliance cartridge in the other. Monitor the output of the high compliance cartridge tracking a blank groove (run-in or run-out is easier, but a scroll shows the effect more clearly) whilst the low compliance cartridge is tracking heavy mod. Granted, the effect is at lowish level, but audible. Given that some audiophools go into ecstasies over effects that demonstrably aren't audible at all, there is at least room for rational curiosity here.

[Ted Kendall]

Originally Posted by Electronpusher0

Not just a mark, at least two otherwise decent decks I have picked up at car boot sales have neat circles of lifted paint and rust where someone has licked the sucker and stuck a dust bug on the deck, neatly trapping a film of water under the sucker.

Peter

Agreed, if users of the Dust Bug had known the silly prices their 301s would fetch fifty years on, they'd have been more careful. Imitators such as Bib used sticky pads and Watts followed in the 70s. The most effective travelling brush, to my mind, was one using carbon fibre and earthed to the turntable chassis - a more elegant way of relaxing static than the fluid one was supposed to apply to the Dust Bug's plush pad.

[bluepilot]

Originally Posted by Ted Kendall

Indeed, low-compliance pickuos can put enough energy into the vinyl that it rattles around the disc and returns as delayed multiple echoes.

You can hear a recording of it here:
http://pspatialaudio.com/weights_clamps.htm

[ajgriff]

Originally Posted by Ted Kendall

OT, maybe, but the contention is eased by direct appeal to experiment, as John Crabbe did - no flat-earther he. Take a turntable with two pickup arms. Place a high compliance cartridge in one and a low-compliance cartridge in the other. Monitor the output of the high compliance cartridge tracking a blank groove (run-in or run-out is easier, but a scroll shows the effect more clearly) whilst the low compliance cartridge is tracking heavy mod. Granted, the effect is at lowish level, but audible. Given that some audiophools go into ecstasies over effects that demonstrably aren't audible at all, there is at least room for rational curiosity here.

I wasn't challenging the existence of the phenomenon which is demonstrable, as illustrated by the audio clip in Stuart's link. It's the comment (possibly tongue in cheek?) about MC cartridges that could lead to an interesting debate.

Alan

[Ted Kendall]

Fair enough - my point was that moving coils in general are stiffer than comparable moving magnets - which is not to say that there aren't moving magnet groove mashers...

[Kentode]

Originally Posted by barretter

There is a very safe way of cleaning a stylus which involves lowering it into a solid gel which clings onto the dirt when you subsequently raise the the stylus out of it. It's not particularly cheap but not massively expensive either ; but I wouldn't play an LP without cleaning it first because (a) the buildup of dirt might be so massive that the stylus comes out of the groove and skates across the record giving you a nice scratch, and (b) there is a great danger of embedding bits of grit in the groove walls where you don't want them.

Hi David, hope you're well, miss seeing you around the market.

I also use this method of stylus cleaning, but I can also recommend using a drop of IPA on a fine artist's brush and stroking from the shank of the stylus towards the tip.

Do this carefully and do not allow the IPA to wick up the shank to the business end of the cartridge.

[barretter]

I used to use a stylus brush with IPA but I once managed to detach the stylus from the cantilever of a rather expensive cartridge using this method. It could be that the IPA gradually dissolved the particular adhesive used on that cartridge ; or maybe I used too much force. I have yet to damage a cartridge using the gel method and it does do the job of removing fluff and dirt very efficiently.
It could be that the flea market reopens next Thursday. I shall need an industrial-strength mask!

[Ted Kendall]

I have a neat little American thing - Discwasher maybe? - which has a pad made from myriad short bristles and folds into a little holder. It was sold with some fluid, which is long gone, but used dry it has done a good job of cleaning my tips for years.

[derekheeps]

Originally Posted by Kentode

Ooh, that's a can of worms Ray!

Twenty people will give you twenty different answers, here's mine.

Knosti Disco Antistat.

I've used mine for more than five years and have a test record from the very first batch of records l cleaned that is still perfectly playable, with no residual stickiness or dust.

Some people hate them!

P.S. Just checked on eBay and it's £20 / litre so the price-gouging seems to be over!

It's your choice. The only problem may be an increase in the cost of replacement IPA when you've finished the bottle included with the kit, as it is touted to be useable to clean your hands of Covid 19!

The best machine ever was made by Keith Monks Audio limited - you could buy the very expensive machine if you were keen , but many of the better hi-fi shops and record shops had the machines , which would wash your records in a solution and vacuum them out , before your records were returned in new inner sleeves - as new , barring wear .

[derekheeps]

Originally Posted by merlinmaxwell

What ever happened to the "Pixall" https://www.amazon.co.uk/MILTY-PIXAL...ges/B003SOULWC ?

Pixel and Nagaoki : horrible devices , although my shop sold them I hated them .

Of course , the best thing is to care for your records from new and keep them clean : zerostat pistol and carbon fibre brush , plus use of a tracking brush like the Michell Sweep Arm ; still available , or marketed in Germany by Transrotor .

[derekheeps]

Originally Posted by ajgriff

Agreed that the stylus cleans out the grime. However, regardless of the method used, cleaning a stylus is an inherently risky business and potentially a very expensive one. On balance I'll stick to cleaning dirty vinyl before the stylus becomes involved.

I should add that I do clean my Denon's stylus occasionally but prefer to keep the frequency to a minimum.

Alan

Even the most expensive stylus , and I include the non user replaceable one in my movie coil AT-OC9 , costs a fraction of the value of even a modest record collection .

With modern 180g vinyl records typically costing £20 upwards , it would only cost 20 or 30 records to equal the cost of a moderately high end cartridge these days .

[ajgriff]

In response to the previous post, surely it's better to avoid the cost of buying new cartridges/styli unnecessarily?

Alan

[Richardgr]

There is probably no right answer, because the type of contaminant to be removed will also be a factor.
I discovered recently that there is a lubricant applied to the press used to stamp the vinyl disc, so that it is easily released from the stamp, and this can remain in the groove and be a cause of noise.
The current fad for ‘180g’ vinyl is meaningless if you do not know how many pressings they make from the master. I have the figures somewhere, where classical used to be around a tenth of the worst pop offenders. I have a few new pressings, and they are incomparable to an old Deutsche Gramofon pressing on a very light vinyl.

So a clean, low noise disc, is going to linked to multiple factors.

[kirstyd]

been cleaning records with washing up liquid and warm water for 50 years .yet to have one suffer any damage. I use a new paint brush with real hair not those plastic things .it gets into all the grooves then just run it under the cold tap [taking care to keep the label dry then its sandwiched between two clean cotton tea towels to dry .The results on 78s are really an eye opener

[Richard_FM]

I heard most classical records were pressed on "virgin" vinyl, pop records were often made from unsold stock melted down & recycled.

Some collectors buy promo copies of records as they are normally the earliest pressings when the stampers are still in decent conditions.