Sony SL-F30 loading /guides problem.

[ben]

Just picked this up from a local house clearance place, it was in immaculate condition as was its remote. Couldn't see anything amiss so tried a sacrificial tape. This jammed up halfway through loading, the machine went a bit haywire, it even tried to eject with the tape half threaded.

I managed to slip the tape loop over the guides and thus the cassette ejected fully, but now the loading ring is jammed. The problem seems to be two metal tape guides which are at the wrong angle and do not fold away. At exactly 1:39 onwards in this video, the one which is supposed to go under the white plastic piece instead sticks out towards the spools, and the one that follows also seems to be out of position.

Is this likely to be relatively straightforward to reposition the guides, or will it be a spine-chilling disassembly process with springs and bits flying off in all directions? I have only really dabbled wit Beta and not disassembled one to any great degree, but willing to have a go if it's feasible!

[greg_simons]

From memory, broken loading ring, which are more or less unobtainium, others here may have more info and possibly a fix.
Greg.

[dj_fivos_sak]

Oh yes. The horrible folding/unfolding guide pins of Sony Beta machines. They break very easily. This video shows the repair procedure for these (skip to 11:41).

Fivos

[ben]

Thanks for the link Fivos. It seems like the flimsy metal bracket bends where the pin hinges, and can be straightened, is that about right?

[dj_fivos_sak]

Yes that's exactly what happens. I recall accidentally bending those guides on my SL-T30ME and failed miserably when I tried straightening them back. Luckily the machine was already beyond repair so I was just using it as a trainer. In general you must be very gentle when working on mechanical parts off 711 chassis machines as they are complex and flimsy decks. The guides are held in place with very tiny screws so you have to be very careful not to lose them, otherwise it's game over, unless you can find something that uses similarly-sized screws like a junk mobile phone.

Regards

Fivos

[ben]

Thanks. I will update when i get round to this.

There is also a spring loose near the pinch roller/solenoid, which makes me think some plastic part has broken somewhere. I will post photos later.

[dj_fivos_sak]

Is it the spring that pushes a metal piece towards the tape-end sensor coil? If so, it's a very common problem with the 711B2 chassis. There are YouTube videos covering that fault.

[Red to black]

Sony issued a repair/mod kit for this deck which consisted of just the two pop up guides which could be replaced instead of a complete loading ring including said guides they only offered previously as a spare part.
Sorry I don't remember the part number, however I do recall you needed to cut away some plastic bits to fit it.

[ben]

Update.
Have managed to reposition the guides. Now there are two things I need to attend to:

1. A loose spring on the right of the deck, right next to the fixing screw for the front load basket. No ide where it is supposed to hook on to - broken plastic spigot on deck somewhere?

2. It seems the guides got bent as the deck kept trying to rotate the load ring, forcing them into their end stops and trying to go past their stoppers. I need to work out what failed and led to this being overdriven. Timing error? sense switches o/c or dirty?

[dj_fivos_sak]

Are you talking about this spring?

[TIMTAPE]

Originally Posted by ben

Thanks for the link Fivos. It seems like the flimsy metal bracket bends where the pin hinges, and can be straightened, is that about right?

In mine the grey cast metal base piece fractured. Thankfully I was able to straighten it and strengthen with glue. Difficult job.

[ben]

Originally Posted by dj_fivos_sak

Are you talking about this spring?

Yes, that's the one! As I suspected the plastic spigot is missing, snapped off. I might just use a small screw in its place.

[ben]

Done.
Now, before powerup and testing, I need to work out whether this loose spring was the reason for the ring being overdriven or the loading jamming. Or if there is some other problem. I can't see any leaf switches, how does this mech detect loading complete or cass down?

Also it all seems very dry. Is there anywhere one should apply grease ?

[dj_fivos_sak]

The right-hand side tape end sensor coil on this machine is used for two things:
1. Detecting the beginning of the tape during rewind.
2. Detecting the fully unlaced position to tell the microcomputer to stop running the loading motor and engage the solenoid when the mechanism reaches its fully unlaced state.

When the plastic hook for that spring breaks, that metal piece will no longer meet the end sensor coil, and thus the microcomputer will no longer receive the signal to stop the motor when the mechanism is unlaced. That basically means the motor will run continiously and damage various mechanical parts, and that's more than likely what happened to your machine.

Regards

Fivos

[ben]

Progress!
I tried fooling the mech without a tape, and it shuffled the basket quite a bit before finally lowering, as it did when I tried it for the first time. I repeated this operation until it became consistent, then tried a cassette. It lowered, threaded, but no transport functions worked. Again, I reloaded it a few times and eventually there was a click (solenoid?) and all the transport worked. I think there's clearly some lack of lubrication or a dirty sensor.

Will try it again later and see if it still loads. I have not connected it to a monitor yet either.

[ben]

Just given it a try. The loading is still a bit erratic from cold - it will either take the cassette a few cm then push it back, or take it in and down then send it back up. After two or three goes, all was well. I hope with regular use that will improve; I would welcome any input on this problem!

I hooked it up to a monitor and the picture quality was excellent, this machine seems to have had extremely low hours. Even the remote has no obvious wear on any keys.

[TIMTAPE]

Have you checked the switch in the chassis just near the supply reel table?

[ben]

Thanks Tim. Have found two black sensors I had not noticed that seem to be connected to leaf switches (cass-in sensors by the look of it) but they're on the take up side rather than supply, I assume they're the ones you refer to...have sprayed a bit of cleaner there and will test it later.

As you can see, I'm totally unfamiliar with these mechs (though I have done simple repairs on the version that came before: SL-C30 etc), so the help is appreciated!

[dj_fivos_sak]

Ben

One of those switches will be for the record protection tab of the cassette, and the other will be for detecting that the cassette has fully dropped down. If you want to trick the machine into thinking there's a tape inside, you would need to pull the two catches of the front loading carriage forward, and then push the cassette-down switch.

Fivos

[ben]

After cleaning the switches on the deck, and one on the right of the front load basket, all seems well. Thanks so much for all the help!