Good afternoon from a new poster - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

StuGill · 23rd Sep 2022, 2:56 pm

Good afternoon.

I am fairly new to old record players etc and have been searching the forum as a guest and then thought I would; register, say hello, explain the story and ask for any pointers.

After the passing of my mother-in-law in January, I helped my wife empty the loft and we found a Gec 2817 music centre, which has a Garrard 6-300 record player. It had been there for ages and didn't work, it isn't valuable but I took a shine to it.

An engineer local to me got it working, the turntable wouldn't work, issues with the radio etc. Watching him also gave me the confidence to dismantle parts of it and it worked well, and to me sounded good for a short while!

The time in the loft hadn't been kind and I think made the 'ears'? in the cartridge brittle, they stop the stylus from moving left and right and have broken.

The Cartridge is a Ceramic Sonotone 3549 and the stylus is a Diamond tipped Garrard KS41B.

Is there a viable alternative, or upgrade? I don't want to go down the road of a Magnetic cartridge.

Thanks in advance.

Stu

Radio Wrangler · 23rd Sep 2022, 3:11 pm

Hello and welcome!

You'll probably need a full cartridge, and that should come with a stylus. There can be a bit of creativity needed to arrange cartridge mounting for those that are still available into the headshell of the turntable. One of the regulars who have an interest in Garrard decks will no doubt be along shortly...

Early and extra-high output cartridges had piezo-electric element made from Rochelle Salt crystals. They are hydroscopic and most have turned to slime by now. Later cartridges used ceramic elements, often Lead-Zirconium Titanate which survives quite well, but has lower output. Some record players from the cheapo end needed the very high output cartridges to allow them to save a valve in the amplifier and save the manufactuter a quid or so.

Music centres came later and well into the ceramic cartridge era along with transistor amplifiers, so you are likely to be safe from the need for an unobtainable cartridge. Some better quality music centres had modern-type magnetic cartridges, into high gain preamplifiers.

Sonotone were a reputable American maker of ceramic cartridges, but are no longer on the go. There are currently some cheap Chinese ceramic cartridges and they have been found to be pretty good replacements, so you have an escape route.

David

RojDW48 · 23rd Sep 2022, 4:59 pm

Sonotone cartridges are still available second hand on the usual interweb sites. But, as David points out - the little red and black Chinese ceramic carts are quite good and very cheap. A magnetic cartridge wouldn't work - output much too low, unless the music centre has an MM option.

StuGill · 23rd Sep 2022, 5:06 pm

Thanks very much for the advice.

If I find a 3549 Sonotone it will be a direct replacement, I think I read somewhere that the 3509/3549/3559 cartridges will all fit in the same bracket, does anyone know if this is definitely the case?

Are the red, or black options an easy fit?

Cheers

Stu

nicam49 · 23rd Sep 2022, 6:24 pm

If you buy a s/h Sonotone, the 'ears' may well be just as brittle!
Probably better to buy a cheapo Chinese one instead. Not sure if your existing mount will be compatible, so try and source one c/w mount.

john600601 · 23rd Sep 2022, 6:38 pm

3509/3549/3559 all fit the same bracket but I have had a run on these lately in ITT players I've been working on, and all have needed replacing, even if they sounded ok they tended to jump on newer records typical symptom of the 'ears' stiffening with age. I have used the readily available Chinese cartridge with excellent success and you may be able to fit it into the existing bracket with some modification or possibly just use an adhesive pad to attach it. Note the black and white wires are reversed on this cartridge the + and - connections on one side are the opposite to how they appear on the Sonotones.

StuGill · 23rd Sep 2022, 7:18 pm

Thanks.

I'll look for one of the Chinese cartridges, is there any that are better than others? Stu

paulsherwin · 23rd Sep 2022, 8:43 pm

They all seem to come out of the same factory, but some are available with different mounting clips and some use turnover LP/78 styluses. As a start, see https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_f...alve&_osacat=0

StuGill · 24th Sep 2022, 11:18 am

Thanks very much for the replies, I'll hunt one down.

Stu

23rd Sep 2022, 2:56 pm	#1
StuGill Diode Join Date: Sep 2022 Location: Watford, Hertfordshire, UK. Posts: 4	Good afternoon from a new poster Good afternoon. I am fairly new to old record players etc and have been searching the forum as a guest and then thought I would; register, say hello, explain the story and ask for any pointers. After the passing of my mother-in-law in January, I helped my wife empty the loft and we found a Gec 2817 music centre, which has a Garrard 6-300 record player. It had been there for ages and didn't work, it isn't valuable but I took a shine to it. An engineer local to me got it working, the turntable wouldn't work, issues with the radio etc. Watching him also gave me the confidence to dismantle parts of it and it worked well, and to me sounded good for a short while! The time in the loft hadn't been kind and I think made the 'ears'? in the cartridge brittle, they stop the stylus from moving left and right and have broken. The Cartridge is a Ceramic Sonotone 3549 and the stylus is a Diamond tipped Garrard KS41B. Is there a viable alternative, or upgrade? I don't want to go down the road of a Magnetic cartridge. Thanks in advance. Stu

23rd Sep 2022, 3:11 pm	#2
Radio Wrangler Moderator Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Fife, Scotland, UK. Posts: 22,901	Re: Good afternoon from a new poster Hello and welcome! You'll probably need a full cartridge, and that should come with a stylus. There can be a bit of creativity needed to arrange cartridge mounting for those that are still available into the headshell of the turntable. One of the regulars who have an interest in Garrard decks will no doubt be along shortly... Early and extra-high output cartridges had piezo-electric element made from Rochelle Salt crystals. They are hydroscopic and most have turned to slime by now. Later cartridges used ceramic elements, often Lead-Zirconium Titanate which survives quite well, but has lower output. Some record players from the cheapo end needed the very high output cartridges to allow them to save a valve in the amplifier and save the manufactuter a quid or so. Music centres came later and well into the ceramic cartridge era along with transistor amplifiers, so you are likely to be safe from the need for an unobtainable cartridge. Some better quality music centres had modern-type magnetic cartridges, into high gain preamplifiers. Sonotone were a reputable American maker of ceramic cartridges, but are no longer on the go. There are currently some cheap Chinese ceramic cartridges and they have been found to be pretty good replacements, so you have an escape route. David __________________ Can't afford the volcanic island yet, but the plans for my monorail and the goons' uniforms are done

23rd Sep 2022, 4:59 pm	#3
RojDW48 Nonode Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 2,074	Re: Good afternoon from a new poster Sonotone cartridges are still available second hand on the usual interweb sites. But, as David points out - the little red and black Chinese ceramic carts are quite good and very cheap. A magnetic cartridge wouldn't work - output much too low, unless the music centre has an MM option. __________________ '....don't go mistaking Paradise for that home across the road!' (Bob Dylan)

23rd Sep 2022, 5:06 pm	#4
StuGill Diode Join Date: Sep 2022 Location: Watford, Hertfordshire, UK. Posts: 4	Re: Good afternoon from a new poster Thanks very much for the advice. If I find a 3549 Sonotone it will be a direct replacement, I think I read somewhere that the 3509/3549/3559 cartridges will all fit in the same bracket, does anyone know if this is definitely the case? Are the red, or black options an easy fit? Cheers Stu

23rd Sep 2022, 6:24 pm	#5
nicam49 Hexode Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Wigston, Leicester, UK. Posts: 351	Re: Good afternoon from a new poster If you buy a s/h Sonotone, the 'ears' may well be just as brittle! Probably better to buy a cheapo Chinese one instead. Not sure if your existing mount will be compatible, so try and source one c/w mount.

23rd Sep 2022, 6:38 pm	#6
john600601 Pentode Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Craven Arms, Shropshire Posts: 111	Re: Good afternoon from a new poster 3509/3549/3559 all fit the same bracket but I have had a run on these lately in ITT players I've been working on, and all have needed replacing, even if they sounded ok they tended to jump on newer records typical symptom of the 'ears' stiffening with age. I have used the readily available Chinese cartridge with excellent success and you may be able to fit it into the existing bracket with some modification or possibly just use an adhesive pad to attach it. Note the black and white wires are reversed on this cartridge the + and - connections on one side are the opposite to how they appear on the Sonotones.

23rd Sep 2022, 7:18 pm	#7
StuGill Diode Join Date: Sep 2022 Location: Watford, Hertfordshire, UK. Posts: 4	Re: Good afternoon from a new poster Thanks. I'll look for one of the Chinese cartridges, is there any that are better than others? Stu

23rd Sep 2022, 8:43 pm	#8
paulsherwin Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Oxford, UK Posts: 27,966	Re: Good afternoon from a new poster They all seem to come out of the same factory, but some are available with different mounting clips and some use turnover LP/78 styluses. As a start, see https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_f...alve&_osacat=0

24th Sep 2022, 11:18 am	#9
StuGill Diode Join Date: Sep 2022 Location: Watford, Hertfordshire, UK. Posts: 4	Re: Good afternoon from a new poster Thanks very much for the replies, I'll hunt one down. Stu