18th Jun 2014, 1:52 am | #21 | |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Quote:
I've been getting them from all over the country, so it's not climate-related. The only loud one so far is Norelco. I only buy the original Philips/BC Components caps. |
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18th Jun 2014, 5:39 pm | #22 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Got one with motor speed way faster than it should be - outputs about 4.9V to the motor instead of average 3.75V! All components seem to be ok on the regulator board - bad 100 Ohm variable resistor?
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19th Jun 2014, 1:46 pm | #23 |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
if the VR tests OK but you're still totally unable to adjust the speed, then you may have a leaky transistor
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19th Jun 2014, 4:54 pm | #24 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Ok I stopping right there - six pieces is more than enough!
So far only half of them work: both Norelco EL3302/52G and one black-grilled Philips EL3302/52G. Two have extremely low and distorted sound. I fed line-level audio direct into the volume control pot and it's still the same. So something in the output stages is at blame. Last one has some self-oscillating in the amp, output stages are fine and too high motor regulator output voltage. I'm sure we have here people knowing those in and out. So any word of advise would be greatly appreciated! Last edited by toshik1; 19th Jun 2014 at 5:03 pm. |
19th Jun 2014, 7:05 pm | #25 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Low and distorted output is due to faulty output transistors AC187/AC188.
What totally puzzles me is that in the meter non-working transistors measure exactly the same as good ones!!! I guess the regulator issue is suffering from defective AC127 or AC128. Edit: Yes the regulator has a defective AC128. |
20th Jun 2014, 11:06 am | #26 |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
germanium transistors sometimes become leaky, out of spec and noisy and still test good on a simple multimeter diode test
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21st Jun 2014, 12:21 am | #27 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Thanks everyone for great help! Feel like repair pro now
I plan to fix them all, keep a few and sell the extras. I also found unlisted in this thread code WT on newer EL3302A/15P with clear cover. I've got Pioneer CT-F1250 in my hands so making calibration cassette is no longer an issue Last edited by toshik1; 21st Jun 2014 at 12:36 am. |
21st Jun 2014, 8:09 am | #28 |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
WT still means it was made in Austria, just not in the Wiener Radiowerke Philips plant i think
you'll find plenty of facts about these recorders in this thread: https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...t=75160&page=5 |
21st Jun 2014, 2:32 pm | #29 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
You are perfectly correct, the grille shield says: "made in Austria"
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21st Jun 2014, 10:57 pm | #30 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Haarlem, Netherlands
Posts: 4,203
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Three codes were commonly used for different factories in Vienna: WR, WT and WD. The latter is mostly used on radios TV sets and videorecorders.
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23rd Jun 2014, 12:06 pm | #31 |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
What's strange is that you're finding Philips branded machines in the US... wasn't Philips forced to use the Norelco brand after Philco sued them in the 50s?
i think they were still unable to use the Philips brand until the 80s when Philco went bust |
23rd Jun 2014, 6:25 pm | #32 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Bringbacks from Europe? None of them but one Norelco came with power adapters.
Last edited by toshik1; 23rd Jun 2014 at 6:54 pm. |
23rd Jun 2014, 10:18 pm | #33 |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
these are very rarely found with power adapters here in europe too, few people bought them and of course most adapters got lost long ago
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24th Jun 2014, 2:24 am | #34 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
I'd imagine not too many Norelcos at all?
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24th Jun 2014, 4:22 pm | #35 |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
virtually none of them here
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26th Jun 2014, 2:07 am | #36 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Got the original replacement AC128 from Germany for the regulator - surprise! Transistor case diameter is about 1mm smaller than the original one so it won't sit tight in the heat sink...
Go figure! I hope the AC187/188 won't have the same problem! |
26th Jun 2014, 12:13 pm | #37 |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
those current production (chinese i think) Germanium transistors always have this smaller package inherited from the French SFTxxx series, which won't fit well in heatsinks made for Philips/Mullard transistors
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27th Jun 2014, 10:18 am | #38 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Guildford, Surrey, UK.
Posts: 1,960
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
Siemens AC128s are also supplied in this undersize package.
I deal with the undersize AC128s by wrapping a small piece of 0.020" brass shim around a suitable drill, filing off any burrs and then pressing it on to the transistor. The shimmed transistor is then a good fit in the heat sink. Ron |
27th Jun 2014, 4:23 pm | #39 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
My transistors are by Tungsram.
I took 0.5 mm brass sheet, cut it to size and made a round tube-spacer to go in between the transistor and original steel heat sink. BWT total recapping was a very good idea-50% of caps were totally dry. |
3rd Jul 2014, 1:21 am | #40 |
Tetrode
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
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Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302
I found another early Norelco EL3302/94 (7th one!) without the spring latch and finally with a different PCB layout!
It has "boxes" on the PCB by the battery compartment end same as shown in service manuals. Will report later. |