Scophony-Baird Cine-Soundmaster Reel - How to play?

[andrewferguson]

Earlier in December I picked up an early reel of audio tape, branded Scophony-Baird Cine-Soundmaster (if anyone's interested, the specific ebay listing I bought is here).

The recorder that used these tapes has already been mentioned before on this forum (in 2011).

The main reason I decided to buy this was it is relatively old compared to other tapes in my collection (1968 is the oldest I had, this is from the late 40s / early 50s I believe) and so I thought there was a (slim) chance that it could contain an interesting recording.

This of course leads to the question of how exactly to play it. The tape is unlike anything I have seen before, less plastic-y and more paper-y (although I suppose it could have dried out over time, I suppose). Not having the recorder, I don't know the head layout or even if the way that this was recorded means that it can even be played back on a conventional deck. Further complicating things, even if it could be played back on a regular deck, the only 1/4-inch deck I have takes a maximum of 5-inch reels, and this is a 7-inch reel...

Based on the above, "how to play this?" is probably more a hypothetical question at the moment. Before I begin trying to source a player that accepts 7-inch reels, I was wondering if anyone more familiar with this can indicate the likelihood that this is even remotely going to work?

[Heatercathodeshort]

It could well be a tape with a 'paper' backing. I have some early 'Sound Mirror' tapes that fit the bill. They are on Paxolin reels. They play back ok on a standard machine with a 7.5 ips speed. They may be full track recordings but they should still reproduce well.
J.

[jamesperrett]

Looking at the other thread it appears to use a full track head. Early magnetic tape was paper based and I'd guess that this is early enough to still use paper. I'd leave it to someone like Ted Kendall to suggest suitable playback machines as he's more familiar with older tape formats than I am though I'd guess that you want something with fairly gentle tape handling.

[Ted Kendall]

I expect the tape is paper - greenish backing and an oxide coating like black paint, which to a first approximation is what it was. This was around under various brand names (Ferrotone for one) from the late 'forties and was standard wear on the original Soundmirror, but faded away as plastic-based tape emerged on to the domestic market.

Mechanically, the stuff is usually still quite strong and winds into a decent pack on a good machine. The replay quality isn't too bad, apart from the background noise, but this was not improved by the permanent magnet erase on the Soundmirror.

To find where the signal is, first make sure you are listening to the oxide side - the Scophony Baird worked oxide-out, but the Soundmirror worked oxide-in. I think the Scophony-Baird was half track, but it may have recorded on the lower rather than the upper half of the tape. Most manufacturers outside West Germany used the upper track, which became the international standard, but there were oddnesses in the earliest machines, not least of which was the Soundmirror layout, which recorded about a 4mm track down the middle of the tape. This can be played back on a full track head, but for best results you need a head which closely matches the recorded track width. The usual dodge here is to use the middle two tracks of a 4/4 machine such as the Teac x440 range, or a NAB cartridge head if you're feeling adventurous.

[paulsherwin]

If you don't have the appropriate hardware and expertise, you can waste a lot of time and money trying to replay a tape which contains nothing of interest. Just because it's old doesn't mean it contains magical secrets..

[andrewferguson]

Thank you Ted for that info. So it seem like there is a chance of being able to use a regular deck to play back the tape. My main concern would be that by playing it I somehow damaged the tape magnetically (eg: by trying to play it I ended up erasing it). Since the chances of doing that are slim (bar a stupid mistake) I guess I'll try playing some of it on my 5-inch deck tomorrow.

And yes, I realise that the likelihood of there being something of interest on the tape are slim... but that's part of the fun for me. It's sort of like a lucky dip where the prizes are better than cheap plastic toys, and every so often you find something interesting. (And collecting tapes is considerably less space-consuming than collecting hardware!)

[Michael Maurice]

You could of course ask someone with better equipment, ie studer decks to play it and digitise its contents for you.

[andrewferguson]

I may well do if there is something of interest on it, but I don't want to waste anyone's time digitizing a blank tape!

[andrewferguson]

A quick update for anyone who's interested in this.

I dug out my 5-inch deck and can confirm that there is at least 'something' on the tape. Unfortunately in doing so I have discovered that the deck (a Ferguson 3220) is not working correctly - it sounds very muffled and I think it may have got too hot last time I used it. So this project is now on hold until I can acquire a more suitable deck (not that I'm going to throw out the Ferguson, but even if I do get it working again it isn't really suitable to play a 7-inch reel anyway).

[ben]

I have some old tape of this vintage and I had problems getting it to run through a machine properly. There was a lot of friction and also I think the actual width of the tape was slightly greater than quarter inch due to ageing and slight expansion. Then of course there's the odd track layout.

Ideally you need a deck without pressure pads and as few fixed contact points in the tape path as possible. Dual capstan types may get you a bit better output and wow and flutter.

[Ted Kendall]

Originally Posted by ben

Ideally you need a deck without pressure pads and as few fixed contact points in the tape path as possible. Dual capstan types may get you a bit better output and wow and flutter.

As in so many things to do with tape, the best tool is a Revox or a Studer. The Japanese dual capstan jobs I have tried flatter only to deceive when it comes to retrieving difficult tapes. The principle is sound enough - my Telefunken M10A has a trailing capstan which is very effective in making cupped tape behave, but then that is a professional machine and built as such.

This is of course a slightly different thing from restoration of machines for their own sake.