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Old 16th Mar 2014, 7:08 pm   #1
ian rose
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Default Marconi MkV11 TV camera

Very interesting to read that Paul M regards the Marconi MkV11 TV camera as his favourite.
I was a TV cameraman for over 20 years and the Mk V11 was quite the worst camera I and my colleagues ever encountered.
Minimum focus was 6 feet rendering it almost useless for studio drama and not much good for light entertainment.
Outside Broadcasting was its only forte.
The focus control was in a ridiculous position and it was generally an unwieldy lump.
They were also a pain from the engineers' point of view since they were constantly drifting 'out of registration' When working with demanding Directors we were always apologising for the poor capabilities of these cameras. Rank Taylor Hobson did produce a dioptre attachment for the beast but it had to be 'flipped' in and out which severely restricted any development shots.
Thank goodness we were allowed to move on to the Marconi MK 8 and then the Mk 9 which were much better products and gave us the parameters we required for studio drama, music and LE.
Regards to all


Edit: Split from: https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...227#post668227

Last edited by AC/HL; 17th Mar 2014 at 2:27 am. Reason: Thread split
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Old 18th Mar 2014, 11:09 pm   #2
PaulM
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Default Re: Marconi MkV11 TV camera

Hmmm., this needs to be put in context and a bit of background revealed. It really isn't as simple as many cameramen (and some techs) seem to see it.

The MkVII was designed in 1966 in the incredibly short time-frame of 9 months to catch the burgeoning US market. It also had to address the likely needs of the BBC/ITV for a quality broadcast colour camera. Now, the needs of the world market were very different to the wants of the BBC (and to large extent, those of ITV). The BBC wanted 4 tubes, it wanted vidicons (so it thought, in 1966) and it wanted integral optics for a short front to back physical size (UK cameramen's demands - not world market ones). The world market wanted a choice of lenses and the relay optics of the MkVII made this latter world demand much easier for the lens makers.
At this time Philips had just brought out the Plumbicon which was a huge improvement over the vidicon and UK (BBC) thinking was still catching up, believing it to be 'soft' which, compared to an image orthicon, it surely was and not even as good as the best vidicons.

Marconi recognised the Plumbicon for what it was - a game changer - and set about designing the MkVII with the untried 'new' tube which had shown real promise in the lab. Philips would not sell Marconi the tubes and the prototypes were built with 'sample' medical variants with the end-user left to buy the 'real' tubes!

The MkVII was novel in so many ways. To overcome the lack of resolution (even with 30mm tubes), Marconi set about designing the first two stored-line vertical aperture corrector which worked a treat! The head as an integral switching power supply (more of an inverter, but still a 'switcher') - the forerunner of how it's still done today in Triax equipped cameras. It's all transistor, except for the head amplifier Nuvistors - replaced with FETs in the MkVIIB. The side handles were also an innovation - simple, but how many other manufacturers copied it! That includes the Soviet 'version' (the USSR's home-produced model). I could go on, but it would take a lot of space and needs to be referenced.

As to your specific criticisms, I find them curious. The RTH lens you describe did have limitations, but please don't blame Marconi or the MkVII for that! Other lenses were available which did not have the problems stated. Furthermore, there were alternatives for the focus handle, including a 'built-in' variant/adaptation.

As to quality, I have quad tapes from 'Southern' of 'Freewheelers' and other programmes. The images are stunningly sharp (for their time) with excellent registration and colorimetry. The latter point is surprising, even to me, as the camera was a compromise between NTSC and SECAM/PAL colour space. I also have a December 1966 quad BBC tape of the 'Black and White Minstrel Show' in colour (the very first and experimental one). It is amazing, and yes, I have dubbed it to C Format for posterity (needs to go to digital now . . .).

I have four of these cameras in operational condition in my fully restored and working 'Southern' OB truck. In my experience (which is broad with experience of numerous cameras), the registration is no more of a problem than with any other 1960s 3/4 tube camera - in fact, the YRGB format was designed to minimise the visibility of errors and this it does. The MkVIIA used conventional deflection yokes and does drift a little - but so did every other manufacturer's cameras of the day! The MkVIIB (about 1968), uses laminated 'PCB' deflection yokes (another innovation) and is very good. With respect, you need to put this into context before criticising and back it up with objective technical facts.

I could go on - and perhaps I should! The above is nothing more than a very brief summary of my researched history and personal knowledge of this ground-breaking camera. In 2014 its reliability is a darn sight better than its contemporary competition. The MkVII is much-maligned by many people, but most of the 'remembered' folk-lore is not evidenced by contemporary documentation. ALL colour cameras of that era were experimental and ground-breaking in their own way. ALL had their foibles (I can give a list for the 2001 and the BBC's contemporary criticisms and complaints of that later 'version').

At the time, the MkVII was ahead of the competition and must be seen through contemporary viewpoints, especially written records and in the case of cameras - videotapes! In the late 1960s colour TV was technically very difficult and it was the engineers of the world (not just in the UK as some would have you believe) that made it 'work'. The MkVII was part of that story, its 'mistakes' and successes alike.

The MkVII's real weaknesses (as opposed to the lens issues) were related to the gamma correctors, the use of steel-cored miniature co-ax, the poor quality of the later production thick-film ICs (itself a new approach), difficulties with the Baddow Labs made delay lines in the aperture corrector and the use of 'Kemet' electrolytics.

This is why oral history can be very dangerous - ALL points of view must be noted, but contemporary written records are more important. The MkVII was an export success and the lessons learned were put to good use in the 3 tube MkVIII, designed in 1969/70, when the UK competition was still making these hugely expensive 4 tube cameras and failing to sell them in the world market.

I would like you to see some of the pictures we have produced in recent years. Bearing in mind that these cameras are knocking on half a century old (at least in design), they are really rather good and will remain my favourite - it was a very important design and actually worked (works, in my case), pretty well!

Perhaps I need to write something at length on this - it is time that the record was made, warts and all. It must not be left to solely negative comments and memories that do not tell the whole story.

Best regards,
Paul M
www.golden-agetv.co.uk
www.projectvivat.co.uk
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 3:55 pm   #3
ian rose
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Default Re: Marconi MkV11 TV camera

Yes, Paul
I was aware at the time of the pioneering nature of colour technology and the engineering positives of the MkV11.
Engineering aspects were not, of course, part of my responsibility. As a cameraman I was concerned with ergonomics of the camera in a production context. They did, as you say, produce good pictures.
The 2001, I seem to remember, was preferred by more cameramen for its ergonomics and its 'feel' although many cameramen preferred a camera produced by a company called, if memory serves, Link.
When the Mk8 [and I think there was a MK9] came along we had a camera which felt more comfortable on pedestal or Mole and which we could 'throw around' the studio and produce some really good work. I think minimum focus was 18 inches but I take your point about different lenses.
Thank you for some interesting engineering background and congrats on preserving a large part of broadcasting history.
How it has changed!!
Best regards

Ian
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Old 29th Mar 2014, 12:13 pm   #4
AidanLunn
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Default Re: Marconi MkV11 TV camera

As far as I know, most cameramen hated the Links. The 110 wasn't so bad, but the 125's pictures look absolutely awful nowadays!
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