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BotleyJoe 13th Apr 2021 11:37 pm

Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Could you give me the benefit of your experience please?

Are vintage (1970’s & 1980’s) British made speakers worth buying?
If so, which ones?
For a budget of say £250 what should I be looking for?
For that sort of money are they likely to outperform my 1980’s Technics 3-way speakers.
For now I’ll be using my Technics amp.

NB - there is a pair of Dynatron LS3038 speakers on eBay at the moment. I can't find any specs online other than they seem to be 3-way. Any thoughts on this model would be appreciated.

Many Thanks in advance.

ToneArm 14th Apr 2021 12:05 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I don't know anything about the Dynatron speakers you are considering. However I love my early 1970s Wharfedale Dovedales that I listen to in my office when I'm working, they are quite large and produce a correspondingly big smooth sound. Very easy to listen to them all day. They cost me very little money 2nd hand, £40 or £50. I think they are too big for a lot of people today.

Ted Kendall 14th Apr 2021 12:16 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Subjective Minefield Alert!

There are many British speakers of this period which still sound fine today - KEF Concertos, 104ABs and the like, Spendor BC1s, IMFs...the list goes on. Whether you can get a good pair of, say, BC1s, for £250 is a matter of luck, but the KEF 104 should come within budget. Speakers of this kind aren't thin on the ground, so take some time to look around and you may do well. I'd say that they would sound beter than what you have, in the sense of being more accurate, but whether you prefer that sound is something you need to judge for yourself. I wouldn't worry unduly about the Dynatrins - you can get better within your budget.

RojDW48 14th Apr 2021 12:51 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
If I am not mistaken, the drivers in these are by Peerless and very nice too! Similar I suspect in sound to Hacker's (Peerless) top of the line speakers - a bit soft for today's taste, but very pleasing.

Edward Huggins 14th Apr 2021 7:47 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Well you don't need a Budget as high as £250 to go buy some very fine Goodmans, Tannoy, Celestion and Wharfedale speakers from the late 1970s to over the whole of the 1980s time period. You will be surprised what excellent sounds you can buy for as little as £50-00! And don't fixate too much on three-way units, they have their strengths but also disadvantages....

Scimitar 14th Apr 2021 8:27 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I can recommend Heybrook, if you can find any!* The Silver series are the best lookers, but they all have that beautiful, smooth British speaker sound. The Silver series are more compact than the originals too, featuring quality Kevlar drivers.

My setup is a pair of HB3 fronts, Heybrook centre and HB1s as surround, teamed up with a Heybrook subwoofer. They are fed from a Denon amplifier and never ceases to please me.

* I have to accept a mismatch of Silver and original series because people will not part with them!

rontech 14th Apr 2021 9:32 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Lentek made some good transmission line speakers using KEF drivers. I had a pair in the late 1980's They were about 10 yrs old when I got them. One speaker needed the long staple wool curtain replacing. The original had collapsed into the bottom of the cabinet. I later ( 1985 - 2007 ) had a pair of KEF 104 Mk 2 reference speakers. They were excellent.

music-centre 14th Apr 2021 9:32 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I can recommend Celestion Ditton 44, had a pair that I used for around 25 years as my main speakers and always liked the big sound they made. Large floor standing speakers though so wouldn't suit everyone.
Steve.

music-centre 14th Apr 2021 10:29 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I don't have experience of the 15 models so cant help really but I think they were more bookshelf types unlike the 44s which were big floor standers (there were the 66 which were even bigger!) depends what sort of speakers you were looking for.
Try a search for the CD15 & 15XR see what sort of reviews they get.
Steve.

PJL 14th Apr 2021 11:13 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
You need to say what size you want, some of the speakers from the 70's were on the large size...

GrimJosef 14th Apr 2021 11:13 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
It is very nearly impossible to recommend speakers. Everything depends

a) on the listener's preferences for type of music, volume level and 'sound',
b) on the listening room and the speakers' placement within them and, quite often,
c) whether anyone else in the house cares about what they look like, where they go and how they sound.

It's a bit like trying to recommend a brand of beer, or a movie, or a partner. I'm afraid there really is no substitute for trying them yourself. (Actually, apart from the question of whether it will go loud enough, and assuming it's of reasonable quality, the choice of amp makes relatively little difference to the sound.)

Cheers,

GJ

Valvepower 14th Apr 2021 11:58 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Hello,

I am currently using a pair of Rogers LS3/6 BBC Studio Monitors and a pair of KEF Kit 3 (Concerto) Loudspeakers with various solid state and valve amplifiers. These are fine for everything from Dusty Springfield and Motown to Hawkwind and AC/DC but as GJ said it a case of personal preference.

Confession’s time as last year I reluctantly had to strip down a pair of KEF Concertos when I as clearing the old house :o sorry about this, however, this was twelfth our stuff as the house was being cleared the day after in preparation to let it out and the space was dearly needed so they had to quickly go – still got the drivers as spares though - that's one good thing. Clearing that old house nearly pushed me over the edge though :o

Terry

BotleyJoe 14th Apr 2021 12:24 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I'm looking for large floor-standing speakers. Up to say about 70cm high.
I take on board the comments regarding the subjective nature of speakers so if I were to ask what makes should be avoided then that would help as well.

Radio Wrangler 14th Apr 2021 1:23 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Speaker designers have done a lot to impove small bookshelf speakers, but there's no substitute for cubic inches to steal a phrase from another world. So by going to large floor standers you give yourself a great advantage over people with more restrictive space.

Choice of speaker is influenced by what sort of things you want to listen to. The room has a big influence too.

People inevitably would like you to choose what they have, and for you to write at length on how wonderful they are. It gives them a happy feeling about their choice. So you'll get a LOT of advice, so much that it'll mostly cancel itself out.

Generally speaking there were some very good speakers made in the 870s and 80s. The currently unfashionable large ones sell for very little money and are often given away. By not being condemned to shoe-box sized things you get a lot of freedoms and a lot better sound.

Some speakers have foam surrounds linking the cones to the frames. These have to flex. Unfortunately the foams proved to not be chemically stable and a lot have crumbled away. Fortunately replacements are available, cheap, and you can scrape off the remains and glue new ones in if you have moderate craft skills - reminiscent of a Blue Peter project :-)

Best look for a decent British make.

KEF
Celestion
Wharfedale
Goodmans
IMF
Spendor
Cambridge udio
Mission
Monitor Audio
Mordaunt & Short
Bowers and Wilkins (Now B&W)
Radford
Then there are Rogers, Chartwell and others making BBC designs, but the prices will be out of the limits you posted.
Quad Electrostatic Speakers are large panels. Sound wonderful, need large rooms and are becoming troublesome to keep maintained.


My personal liking is for what are called Transmission-line speakers. Tend to be large, but wonderfully extended and controlled bass. Can properly reprocuce a 'thump' sound without turning it into a 'boooooom' IMF, Radford, Cambridge did these.

A while ago someone on here picked up a couple of magazine project come kit speakers for a few pounds. Atkinson monitors. An amazing bargain. He didn't know what they were. If the luck is upon you, wonderful things can happen. There is also a Chris Rogers design called PRO9TL.

David

Whaam68 14th Apr 2021 1:47 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Some Castle speakers I've heard sound very nice and are easy to drive....I have a couple of sets of their early stand mount Richmond's (not what you are looking for) but they also made some larger floor standing units. Tangent are also supposed to be very good as well as the usual suspects mentioned.

It's usually more about what comes up and I've had more success on gumtree/freecycle and the like for big speakers advertised locally over the years than ebay. Depending on the drivers foam rot can also be a problem as mentioned already.

Edward Huggins 14th Apr 2021 2:32 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by GrimJosef (Post 1364192)

....and assuming it's of reasonable quality, the choice of amp makes relatively little difference to the sound.)

Cheers,

GJ

It may not make much difference to the sound, but it may make a difference to the "loudness" e.g. a low power valve amplifier driving speakers of low sensitivity....So what amplifier is the OP planning to use?

BotleyJoe 14th Apr 2021 4:39 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Thank you. That's all very helpful.

I'll be using my Technics ZU-Z1 amp for now but a valve amp is on the wish list when funds allow. My ideal speakers would be ones which would give a high level of "detail" without having to crank the volume up.
In other words, a high level of "sound" without a high level of volume.

GrimJosef 14th Apr 2021 5:47 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Huggins (Post 1364255)
Quote:

Originally Posted by GrimJosef (Post 1364192)

....and assuming it's of reasonable quality, the choice of amp makes relatively little difference to the sound.)

Cheers,

GJ

It may not make much difference to the sound, but it may make a difference to the "loudness" e.g. a low power valve amplifier driving speakers of low sensitivity ...

When I said "apart from the question of whether it will go loud enough" that was what I meant. Maybe it wasn't clear. Or maybe I should have shouted it LOUDER ;D ?

Cheers,

GJ

qualityten 14th Apr 2021 6:29 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BotleyJoe (Post 1364306)
Thank you. That's all very helpful.

I'll be using my Technics ZU-Z1 amp for now but a valve amp is on the wish list when funds allow. My ideal speakers would be ones which would give a high level of "detail" without having to crank the volume up.
In other words, a high level of "sound" without a high level of volume.

This means that you are looking for speakers of high-ish sensitivity.

It would be useful to know the size of the room you’ll be using and what genre(s) of music you’ll usually be listening to.

Also, if you’re contemplating a valve amp, do you have any thoughts on this? The key issue is matching the speakers to the other equipment and the space.

BotleyJoe 14th Apr 2021 7:40 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
About 30m2 at the moment but the lounge is bigger so I could move the kit in there.
70's/80's rock & pop mainly but lots of other stuff as well.
Unfortunately I don't know much about valve amps - that was going to be another "Help" request further down the line when I have saved up some more.

Kyri 14th Apr 2021 8:20 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
This is a really interesting topic. Having recently acquired a stereo valve amp I was challenged with finding suitable speakers for it.

I have some mid 80’s Monitor Audio speakers, which are quite big and some years ago found themselves on top of the kitchen units out of the way, and spaced quite far apart (3m or so). The old JVC music centre powering them originally had 8ohm speakers so the match was OK. They are used for listening to the radio mostly, or music, whilst cooking, dining, etc.

When I first got the valve amp, despite being told it was a 3-4 ohm output -
perhaps the previous owner had looked at the speakers originally attached to it. I fitted the 8 ohm JVC speakers and it was “OK”. I would not likely have done this if the mismatch was the other way around. These JVC’s are more modern than the monitor audio and obviously made to a lower price point, and slightly smaller but the sound was pretty good. It was only when I tried the Monitor Audio’s that it transformed both the sound (bigger, better, fuller) and the volume (louder, if you want it to be).

Anyway, the point is, buying without trying could be risky as it is all so subjective; these speakers match my amp in my opinion so I am happy. The problem is the rest of the family keep asking when the big speakers are going back into the kitchen. “It doesn’t sound the same.....” :)

PaulR 14th Apr 2021 8:54 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
As others have said this is such a subjective topic. I have a pair of Bowers and Wilkins DM4 speakers that I really like. I bought them several years ago for £60 odd but the Ebay asking price is a lot more than that now.

McMurdo 14th Apr 2021 11:15 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
1 Attachment(s)
I use a pair of 70's mk1 Castle Richmond speakers for monitors. They're superb, and cost me around £20 the pair a few years ago. I was surprised what I got them for and only imagine it was due to their 'cheap 70's record player accessory' look to them. Why settle for a copy when you can afford the original?

A properly working pair of 70's/80's high end british speakers need not be expensive, and most have a well-deserved reputation.

jamesperrett 14th Apr 2021 11:54 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I don't know the Dynatron LS3038's but I have a pair of LS4038's here which are also large floor standing speakers. The LS4038's are actually Wharfedale Unit 5 kits which have been presumably put into Dynatron cabinets. The Unit 5 kits were based on the Wharfedale Dovedale but with a simplified crossover. While they may not be as revealing as some of the more collectable alternatives, they have a very pleasant sound with plenty of deep bass and I use them for TV sound where they handle thuds and explosions very well.

There are plenty of similar alternatives that others have mentioned - just be careful if you are buying speakers that use foam surrounds on the drivers - these will often need replacement as they have a limited lifespan.

majoconz 15th Apr 2021 12:56 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I bought a pair of KEF Corellis for NZ$50 on our local web auction with a note to say one of the T27 tweets was u/s. "Should be easy to find another" I thought in ignorance - Huh! Anyway I found a pair of T27 look-a-likes for a reasonable price which were more sensitive so a resistor in series was selected which seems to balance well. I sold the T27 for more than I paid for the KEF's!
A pair of B&W 2003's sit out in the garage sulking - I liked them but swmbo didn't like the 'black lumps' - much preferred the nice wood on the KEF's. Nuff said!

Edward Huggins 15th Apr 2021 8:55 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
If you are thinking of a valve amplifer in due course, you really do need to consider speakers of a sensitivity of c.91dB. These would be usually of the floor-standing, reflex type. Indeed for your currect Technics SU-Z1, which is a relatively low-powered transistor amplifier, you will find they would give it a new lease of life!

BotleyJoe 15th Apr 2021 9:40 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler (Post 1364221)
......My personal liking is for what are called Transmission-line speakers. Tend to be large, but wonderfully extended and controlled bass. Can properly reproduce a 'thump' s.......David

Is this current eBay item an example of what you mean 133715720642 ?

The right size and on the budget but if spending that much I'd prefer to buy from an enthusiast rather than a "trader".

I can see from the listing that these are rated at 8Ω and 25W (CW). My existing speakers are also 8Ω but the power rating is 75W music/50W DIN (matched to the amp). So on the face of it, these large speakers would be over-powered by the amp. Somehow that doesn’t feel right. I bought my existing speakers in 1982 (part of a matched system) so they come from the same era as the CA’s. What is the relationship between the stated power ratings on old speakers?

The old foams have been mentioned a few times. Does anyone have a photo of the foams to help me understand the issue and what to look for? If there is a DIY repair thread on here I can refer to?

I get the feeling that patience will pay off here so I’ll start looking in the larger charity shops and keep an eye on eBay for local listings so I can have a proper look and listen.

Many thanks for all the advice so far. Please keep it coming.

Any thoughts on valve amps also welcome.

Cobaltblue 15th Apr 2021 9:52 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
1 Attachment(s)
There are plenty of good YouTube videos on how to do this.

First example I found : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwcfP5pKeek

The parts are available cheaply.

If it looks like this one its way past time to re-foam :)

Cheers

Mike T

simpsons 15th Apr 2021 10:16 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
A picture says a thousand words and so it is with Dynatron loudspeakers.

The 3038's you have seen are quoted as Peerless loudspeakers whilst the 4038 are not, these being a Wharfdale kit both of which fitted in a box with unknown construction. Similar models can be seen with a common thread.

The Peerless speakers are said to suffer from a common fault, that is the tweeter fails.

All of this is really pie in the sky, in my opinion, as there are no independent reviews of these speakers and this is where it all gets messy.

Looking at todays HiFi Magazine reviews, there is no technical analysis just opinion about how a particular record sounds. Warm, bright, just hear the bass, da di da. Eh? Well, call me stupid but I suggest to keep the advertisers on board, any critical review would lose them a lot of adverts.

Compare this with say the B&W DM4 TNT review. Here the review has been written by someone who knows a thing or two about sound and it gives the reader information which provides a bench mark to judge others.

Now, back to the question. What gives you the best bang for the buck?

Before I give you my two-penneth a little history of how recordings for vinyl and much of what goes for non classical music are tailored to what the listener is going to use to hear them.

The monitors used in the recording studio are there to play back the recording as faithfully as they can at the volume of a live performance.

Play the same recording at home on a, for example, on Bush SRG 31 record player and the 6X4 loudspeaker would lose its will to live as would the listener. Have it played at the correct volume through say a Transmission line speaker or similar high end unit and the Council will soon be knocking at your door.

The recording studio know this and tweek or mix down the sound for just this reason and so your choice of speaker comes down to the "presence" or impact you expect or the faithfulness of what you expect from the speaker.

So, should you require a speaker that is unforgiving, go for a monitor quality but if its all boom and tizz well, then that's your perogative.

I have Celestion Ditton 44's and Tannoy Eaton's both of which crucify poor recordings and sound very similar but note that these are on stands. The Celestion's will cost you £250, the Tannoy's £1000. I also have listened to Quad electrostatics and they are just something else but so is the price and maintenance bill. There are many other good loudspeakers out there and members have shared their experience.

What I do find is that the master recordings rather than the vinyl or even cd release are in a different league.

So, in conclusion, using your budget, list the sale price the well known site shows said loudspeaker will cost, look up the review. If it says what you are looking for and armed with the a recording you are familiar with, go round to the seller's place and see if it sounds what you are looking for.

Hope this all helps and good luck.

Chris

Trigon. 15th Apr 2021 10:43 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
1 Attachment(s)
It's not just foam surrounds that deteriorate, but rubber roll surrounds as well (this on 12" driver from a 1969 Wharfdale Dovedale):-

Attachment 231809

It looked ok and seemed to flex as the cone was pushed, but pressing a finger into it snapped bits off...

There had been a clue in the disappointing bass response - the free air resonance was over 100Hz! A new roll brought it down to 20Hz.

Cheers

Whaam68 15th Apr 2021 7:29 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
1 Attachment(s)
More 60’s than 70’s but I suppose I should put in a vote for the old Heathkit Cotswolds ....15 ohm and I’ve driven these with 3.5w valve amps through to 70w solid state and they sound (to me) lovely on either. I think I paid £60 locally from gumtree minus the legs! Big speakers are generally not that fashionable and difficult to post.

GrimJosef 15th Apr 2021 7:46 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Huggins (Post 1364489)
If you are thinking of a valve amplifer in due course, you really do need to consider speakers of a sensitivity of c.91dB ...

Depends on the amp. A Radford STA25 or a Dynakit Stereo 70 will give most domestic transistor amps a run for their money. It also depends how loud you want your music to be. I've run my Rogers JR149s (83dB/W @ 1m) off a pair of Quad IIs (15W each) and as long as you don't want Lemmy from Motorhead in your living room they were surprisingly good. If you do then get hold of a VTL ST150.

Cheers,

GJ

Cruisin Marine 15th Apr 2021 8:04 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I have some large Wharfedale Dovedale's I got them cheap about 6 years back- quite frankly, they are by a big margin the best I have owned and maybe the best I have heard. Smooth as hell and you really hear stuff you don't on many other speakers.

mole42uk 15th Apr 2021 8:25 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
No-one has mentioned Keesonic, IMHO the best of the ‘70’s speakers. Get a pair of KRF or Rangers (both pretty big) and your ears should be happy. Peter Keeley was a brilliant loudspeaker designer but an awful businessman.....

Radio Wrangler 15th Apr 2021 10:05 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
You should have seen the pattern by now:

1) There are some excellent speakers for very little money IF you can live with larger cabinets.

2) You might have to glue in some new surrounds for bass/midrange drivers.

3 Worst case, You might find one or two dead tweeters and have to pick an modern substitute but they're not expensive and you can pick something a little more sensitive and trim it down with a resistor. Adjust to taste - YOUR taste.

Go for it!


DAvid

BotleyJoe 15th Apr 2021 10:07 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Going for it! :)

These are on an auction site at the moment and only about an hours drive. Managed to find three reviews which didn't help much. Here is one...

https://www.techradar.com/uk/reviews...i-97106/review

GrimJosef 15th Apr 2021 10:57 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Are they 'vintage' enough for you ?

Cheers,

GJ

BotleyJoe 15th Apr 2021 11:03 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Huggins (Post 1364489)
If you are thinking of a valve amplifer in due course, you really do need to consider speakers of a sensitivity of c.91dB. .....

I have seen "sound-pressure level" (SPL) referred to in a review. Is that the measurement we are referring to here? When you say circa 91db what degree of margin is acceptable. Eg is 92db within range (eg as quoted for KEF 104.2)?

BotleyJoe 15th Apr 2021 11:05 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by GrimJosef (Post 1364829)
Are they 'vintage' enough for you ?..GJ

Well, not what I had in mind originally but reading all these excellent contributions is widening my horizons :)

simpsons 15th Apr 2021 11:57 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Well, as the review for the 908 is not exactly enthusiastic, perhaps it has saved you the hours journey.

Whilst you may have Vintage speakers in your "ideal" list, it is important to know that modern materials can have a marked influence, for the better, on your listening experience.

It is important though to avoid any speakers which either will need re-foaming or replacement drivers. In the first instance, whilst re-foaming is not difficult, I have done this quite satisfactorily on Accoustic Reasearch AR15 bass units. I did this because I knew the expected results made it worthwhile.

Replacement speakers can be a minefield should the driver no longer be available. There will be few if any direct replacements. The cross over design will be right for the original but wrong for anything else and the speaker will sound unbalanced. Plus, of course you will need to buy 2 so they match!

Perhaps the best way is to draw up a short list of preferred speakers and just wait for the "chosen one" to turn up.

By all means list your selection and ask members their views.

Chris

nickdoofah 16th Apr 2021 2:03 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Wharfedale Dovedale III's All day long! These are not a great looking loudspeaker but you will soon forget that - Sit between them, turn the volume up & just enjoy the incredible sound they deliver! These speakers aren't too fussy where you locate them either! In my mind, these are amazing value for money & they have a lovely sweet dome tweeter that isn't too shrill - The bass is the best part for me though & I am still thinking of buying a pair to replace my modern but not so good Wharfedales...

lazythread 16th Apr 2021 7:48 am

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
As you want to use a valve amplifier in the future you could try Monitor Audio R352 speakers. There is an R352MD option with metal dome tweeters.

They have a high sensitivity, ca. 91dB/1 watt. I have had mine for 36 years and they've been powered by both solid state and valve amplifiers.

Jez1234 16th Apr 2021 4:49 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Some ahem... "unusual" recommendations coming up in this thread...

Unless the OP is a real headbanger or has a palatial living room don't be too concerned about either efficiency or power handling. Actually an amplifier of too low an output is far more likely to damage speakers than one of high output as when an amp clips it produces a great deal of HF energy which tends to blow tweeters. Hence it being so common to see blown tweeters in speakers that have been turned up for a party etc.

Specifying power handling for speakers is an extremely imprecise "science" at the best of times and it is perfectly OK to use speakers rated at say 25W with a 100W amp so long as you have a reasonable degree of "mechanical sympathy" and take into account the nature of the program material. Well recorded materiel with good dynamic range will have a high peak to mean ratio and eg individual kick drum beats may well peak at say 40W into 25W rated speakers without damage, however, a speaker rated at 100W could easily have its tweeter blown by a continuous tone at say 8KHz even if unclipped and at "only" 10W.

My main speakers are Spendors of a pretty average efficiency of around 87-88dB/W and in my slightly smaller than average sized living room I find even 10WPC from my modded Leak Stereo 20 valve amp can produce pretty loud volumes and bass you can feel.

The human ear/ear-brain interface is extremely non linear in it's perception of volume and in fact to get twice the volume of a 10WPC amp you need about 100WPC. Hence there is little practical difference in max volume between say a 30W amp and a 50W amp. Conversely an average level of only 1W is amazingly loud and many would guess they were hearing more like 10W...

As to specific recommendations well as others have said it's highly subjective... You really must take the room into account as room acoustics can have a profound effect on sound quality and a speaker that sounds great in one room can sound awful in another. Then there's speaker placement. Some speakers are intended to be positioned close to a rear wall (eg Heybrook HB3's and most Linn models) whilst others are meant to be used well clear of any walls (Spendor BC1, KEF 104 etc etc). Almost all need to be kept away from corners (corner horns etc excepted of course) and most away from side walls. Ideally you need to try speakers in your own listening room before committing to purchase but this can be impractical if buying second hand.

BotleyJoe 16th Apr 2021 6:33 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jez1234 (Post 1365039)
.....Unless the OP is a real headbanger or has a palatial living room don't be too concerned about either efficiency or power handling. ........

I am most definitely not a headbanger :) My hearing is still very good and I want to keep it that way. I like to enjoy my music at modest volumes, what I describe as "lots of sound without lots of volume". I've set my turntable up with a cartridge/stylus combination which gives me a nice "rich" bass but can also pick out high notes like tapping a high-hat. So I know the current amp and speaker set-up can find those sounds.

So my thinking behind the quest for large speakers is based on an assumption that a larger cabinet will make the bass "fuller/richer" and the larger mid-range and tweeters will be able to bring out more of what ever else the LP (or CD) has to offer.

Does that make sense?

Radio Wrangler 16th Apr 2021 6:50 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Perfect sense.

with a good speaker, having extended bass, you can hear different notes 'down there' like the pedal department of a pipe organ.

Manufacturers of small speakers often have their bass tailing off at too high a frequency, dictated by dimensions, but try to make up for it using a bump in the frequency response just before the roll-off. It adds thump to drums but it's a thump determined by the speaker, not the drum. It gets disparaged as 'one-note bass' and all drums sound the same. OK if you like Hollywood blockbusters.

David

GrimJosef 16th Apr 2021 6:57 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Genuinely high-fidelity speakers (like high-fidelity anything) will not aim to change the sound of your music. Their job is to present it to you as the recording artists intended. But in the real world there are limitations of course. The famous three-way trade-off between efficiency, physical size and bass extension is real. Essentially you can have two of those. So what bigger speakers do is to go deeper into the bass without losing efficiency. Size doesn't matter significantly as far as the tweeters are concerned.

In practice no speaker is perfectly high-fidelity. They all change the sound to a greater or lesser extent. Some people select their speakers to compensate for the inevitable issues with their room, aiming to get a combined effect which is close to what the musicians wanted. Others like all their music to be altered away from what the musicians wanted. I think of this as being a bit like my brother who, when he was young, went through a phase of putting brown sauce on almost every food he was presented with. The various people who had cooked it thought they knew how sausages/roast lamb/fish and chips/beans on toast etc should taste, but he disagreed. He wanted everything more 'brown saucy'. In the case of speakers, choosing ones which 'sauce up' all the music is the owner's right - he's paying for them and then living with them, after all.

Cheers,

GJ

Jez1234 16th Apr 2021 7:31 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
"Hoffman's Iron Law" indeed...

matherp 16th Apr 2021 7:53 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I've just inherited my late father's Spendor BC1s and they meet that requirement perfectly. I'm driving them with an early eighties Denon PMA-737 which matches them nicely.

Jez1234 16th Apr 2021 8:05 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
Spendor BC1, BC2 or SP1 are superb speakers even by modern standards but probably not within budget.

Restoration73 16th Apr 2021 8:09 pm

Re: Vintage British Speakers - Advice Please.
 
I use my Rogers LS5s every day !


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