ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

http://www.sothebys.com/en/auctions/...86/lot.41.html

I wonder how much it will make??

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

Over 20 years ago I was asked if I would sell one on a small commission. He wanted I think £700. I was tempted to buy it myself, but thought "what would I do with it?"
Very shortly after this I was contacted by a Professor (of cryptology, I think?) wanting to buy it. I gave him the details of the seller, who was IIRC in Netherlands.
It was in wonderful condition, and I think was made just after WW2.
I wonder what it would be worth now, considering the interest that is now shown.
Rob

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

I am wondering why the morse key?

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

The encrypted output of an ENIGMA was generally sent using CW over HF radio-links.

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

Quite. The Enigma was a laborious thing to use, converting plain text to cipher text one character at a time. Only when the cipher was complete, it was sent by morse in groups of five characters. At the receiving end it was input one character at a time into a machine set up identically to the sending one to recover the plain text.

The women who did the intercepts in the UK could recognise who was sending the message - they said they could recognise the "fist" of the German who was sending the morse.

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

Well that is Christmas sorted!

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

As a technical interest point the description states that the green filter has been replaced. This is a very good thing as acid emission from some of the original filters has severely damaged the typing keys on many enigma machines in storage.
source: cryptomuseum.com/crypto/enigma/warning.htm


Pete

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

Dunno, David. Don't you need someone else to have one in order to have endless fun swapping secret messages?

David

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

True, but I don't think there was ever an Enigma that keyed the letters to a transmitter in real time. I would expect that the enciphered letters would be written on a message pad in groups and then sent by CW, RTTY or possibly Hellschreiber and a message could be sent phonetically by voice.

There was a version that printed out the text, I believe, or an attachment that printed it.

73

Roger

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

Hmmm, a three roter (sic) "enima" machine. I might 'pass' this one...


What were the green filters for?

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

The enigma machines were hand operated, and morse was hand-sent over radio. At Bletchley the Bombes were used along with a number of graphical aids to crack the enigma settings - the 'grundstellung', plugboard combination, and which rotors were fitted. I suspect the cyphertext was written out both on the sending and receiving ends.

The Germans also used a machine operating on the enigma principle to encrypt and decrypt teleprinter messages in real time. Colossus was designed to crack the teleprinter codes.

David

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

As these machines were used before and during the war with both land and sea versions (the 4 rotor machine) I wander how many Enigma machines were produced for the war and how many now remain unaccounted for? It seems rather expensive for what was possibly once a common machine that was used along with other radio communications equipment.

Christopher Capener

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

The Lorenz SZ42. I restored the one at Bletchley. And the only thing in common with Enigma is the use of twos complement to generate the cipher.

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

Looks like the Enigma didn't sell, or was withdrawn.

Feynman's Nobel Prize did quite well though...

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

The enigma machine was firstly used in the Spanish civil war 1936-1939.

Is estimated that the dictator Francisco Franco bought 50 enigma machines, model D for 600 germans mark each one, more or less 800 pounds of now days (1000 euros). Today still survive many machines. Recently, many machines were discovered in the Buenavista palace, and 26 more in the Army General Headquarters, 12 more in the Mayor State (EMAD) and a few more in the National Intelligence center (CNI).

After the exceptional discover, many enigma has been distributed in different museums. I have seen 2 or 3.

Also, Hitler sent troops to help the dictator and the used as well the enigma in the Spanish civil war, when they leave Spain in 1939, they left there the machines.

https://elpais.com/elpais/2008/10/11...21_850215.html

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

Blimey - Feynman's Nobel Prize! Nearly a million dollars. Feynman would have some pithy remark about that for sure.

All the Feynman stuff went for huge money.

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

The one being auctioned dates from 1934, so could be one of those recently discovered. If it's only one of many the reserve may have been a bit ambitious.

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

I don't know what price was associated with this particular machine, but I am aware owners of them insure them for figures in the region of £25,000.

Such values obviously have no connection whatever with the level of technology involved here. They are no more than a box of switches, plugs, sockets, bulbs and a bit of mechanics. Nice box - perhaps. So technically its really little more than you get in a child's electrical educational toy.

The value obviously is in the historical association - and plainly many individuals treat WWII history as the biggest event of all time. I would only say "that's a viewpoint - other viewpoints are possible" :). Clearly being close in time to our personal lives, and almost certainly most of us have/had parents who personally lived through it, this is history written in very big letters indeed, and acquiring an artefact that somehow captures a little bit of those events means a great deal to many.

Chunks of the former Berlin wall are similarly "worthless" but similarly are highly prized.

Personally I am much more interested in those artefacts that are technically significant - though "history" may well have passed them by. An example would be radar - treated as an "also ran" by historians and those interested in technology - it doesn't really command any serious museum space that I know of in the UK.

Technically radar was a whole new branch of technology developed prior and during WWII - and its spin-offs continued to flow in following decades. Enigma has very little technical significance that I can spot. And in terms of the effect on WWII of each: having radar and the ground controlled intercept system meant that Britain avoided being invaded and totally losing the war. All Enigma did - according to many historians - was to shorten the war by a couple of years.

Richard

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

RAF Neatishead is well worth a visit - very good explanation of the Chain Home system and much else.

Re: ENIGMA machine being auctioned.
 

Cracking the Enigma codes did advance the development of computers, not just Turing's work but some of the first American ones.