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Vintage Audio (record players, hi-fi etc) Amplifiers, speakers, gramophones and other audio equipment.

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Old 4th Jun 2014, 4:56 pm   #1
simone2020
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Default Please help me choose a Record Player!

Hello

I'm looking to buy a new record player, but think I need some help. Have done a lot of research but I'm very confused as there seems to be so much to consider!

I have an old 80's sony record player at my mum's, it was a cheap one that my nan bought when she was younger and I claimed it when she was going to throw it out. I love it but it's very old and bulky (I now live in a small flat), with big old fashioned speakers and not very good sound. It's completely manual, so that is what I'm used to. This is how I fell in love with vinyl records.

I want to buy myself a nice record player now, my budget is up to £200. I know that I'm looking at turntables here, but I just can't afford more.

I'm looking for a record player with following features:

- good quality sound (not necessarily the best, but good - it will be for home listening, but I want good sound quality if I'm spending this money)
- won't ruin my records- simple to use and maintain (I'm no techie)
- looks nice (I've seen some that seem to meet all of the above, but are so ugly, e.g. Audio Technica turntables - urgh).
- can plug in an external speaker through a jack cable, unless the volume of the turntable itself is high enough for parties.
- I'm tempted to get one with mp3 capability too, but not a necessity.
- a lid/cover would be good too, as I live in central London and it gets very dusty.

I'm drawn to vintage record players, because they just look so lovely, I love the thought that they're still being used today after all this time, and it's a form of recycling. But Ive heard that a lot of them can ruin your vinyl records.

I've heard a lot of good things about the Project Essential II as a modern option. As a vintage option, I've been told that a Pioneer PL-12D would be good for me, but I've also read it can have a few problems including playing too fast or low. Any thoughts on these?

Any recommendations or thoughts would be great! Sorry for such a long post.

Thanks,
Simone

Last edited by simone2020; 4th Jun 2014 at 5:11 pm. Reason: Additional info
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Old 4th Jun 2014, 5:13 pm   #2
unitaudio
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Default Re: Please help me choose a record player!

Hello and welcome to the forum. If sound quality and record care are important (and reading your post, they are), a good rule of thumb is to avoid plastic turntables and arms and anything with a mono only pickup cartridge. I appreciate that only narrows things marginally but it should be a good starting point.

Regards,
Paul
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Old 4th Jun 2014, 5:39 pm   #3
'LIVEWIRE?'
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Default Re: Please help me choose a record player!

Also bear in mind that turntables such as the Pioneer PL-12D are just that - i.e. they have no internal amplifiers, and have to connected to an amplifier or receiver which has inputs for a magnetic (moving magnet) cartridge. Whilst most older HiFi amps. (pre 1990s at a guess) have this facility, many, if not most, more recent ones do not.
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Old 4th Jun 2014, 5:49 pm   #4
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Default Re: Please help me choose a record player!

If space really is at a premium, you should start by buying a good quality microsystem. Avoid anything very cheap (under £150) and try to audition it before buying. These systems will never be true hifi but many have very acceptable sound and take up very little space. Make sure anything you choose has a line level input for an external device.

Once you have this, get hold of a 1970s or 80s record deck by one of the big Japanese manufacturers. The PL-12 is a good example but has become fashionable and so greatly overpriced for what it is. Look for something by less fashionable brands like Aiwa or Toshiba.

Finally you will need a phono preamp to match the record deck to your microsystem. These are just small boxes and are available at a vast range of prices but the cheapest commercially made ones are probably fine for your needs. I think Maplin sell them.

Plug the record deck into the preamp, plug the preamp into the line level input, and off you go.
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Old 4th Jun 2014, 5:55 pm   #5
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Default Re: Please help me choose a record player!

Paul's solution is good.

But do you have some kind of sound system already, apart from the Sony which you seem to have fallen out of love with?

Nick.
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Old 4th Jun 2014, 6:20 pm   #6
simone2020
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Default Re: Please help me choose a record player!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 'LIVEWIRE?' View Post
Also bear in mind that turntables such as the Pioneer PL-12D are just that - i.e. they have no internal amplifiers
Thanks, so if I got an integrated amp with built-in phono pre-amplifier, would that improve it and would I even be able to use it with the Pioneer? And would it be worth the effort?

Sorry if I'm asking stupid questions, I really have very little idea what I'm talking about!
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Old 5th Jun 2014, 4:44 am   #7
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

Quote:
Sorry if I'm asking stupid questions, I really have very little idea what I'm talking about!
There's never a stupid question asked on these boards and the answers are always given with enthusiasm & pleasure....so ask away.

OK, so you say:
Quote:
"I really have very little idea what I'm talking about"
but you seem to be instinctively asking the right questions & with the right priorities to achieve success.

Good luck and never be a stranger here.
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Old 5th Jun 2014, 8:44 am   #8
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

Most direct drive turntables have a speed adjustment and strobe so you can ensure it is
rotating at the right speed, or overcome any musical pitch error. They also have low
rumble - the Technics SL1200/1210 is well known and a good example quite affordable
as the DJ's who used them for performance have turned to digital devices.
http://www.mds975.co.uk/Content/vinyl01.html
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Old 5th Jun 2014, 12:38 pm   #9
unitaudio
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

If you want a separates system, an integrated amplifier with a built in phono pre-amp is a must. If you don't want the hassle of separates you could buy a system with record deck and amplifier combined in one unit. But you already have one of these, the Sony. With such all-in-one systems there's always a trade-off in terms of sound quality in favour of simplicity and convenience when compared with separates systems and I suspect that's why you're no longer satisfied with the Sony. Don't let that put you off Sony separates though, they made some good gear in the 1970's and 80's which can still be had at reasonable prices and is well worth considering. Aesthetics are important to you as well and equipment from many makers from the 1970's scores highly in this respect. Build quality and finish was particularly good back then. And there's no need to spend a fortune either. I've got a stylish, good-sounding system from the 70's which cost me very little, certainly under £100.

Regards,
Paul
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Old 5th Jun 2014, 4:14 pm   #10
jamesperrett
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

One other thought - some manufacturers made decent turntable/amplifier combination units - there are even some decent music centres (turntable/amp/radio/cassette) around. I'm thinking about people like Dynatron, Tandberg or even certain Sony systems. When we looked at our house, there was a nice looking compact Dual system sitting in the garage but my wife insisted that the owners clear out the garage before we move in so I've no idea what happened to it. I still have my great uncle's Dynatron HFC101 though.
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Old 5th Jun 2014, 6:13 pm   #11
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

Jamesperrett
Yes I agree with that line of thought, there were some good unit systems back in the 70s from Britain, Europe aswell as Japan, as mentioned Sony produced some very nice ones. if space is limited then going for a unit type system is no bad thing at all.
I am wondering if the offending system is one of Sony's HMK/P/W systems the bottom models had one of the most noisy (rumble) decks I have ever come across..........a bad time for some Sony turntables

Gary
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Old 5th Jun 2014, 6:44 pm   #12
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

I've got 2 Technics SL-5 direct drive linear tracking turntables here, both bought for peanuts! They need an external amplifier, but they sound pretty good to me, they are not expensive, and the cartridges are easy to find, and the stylus can be replaced easily.

One I would avoid is Bang & Olufsen's Beogram 5000, or indeed anything by them that uses their MMC# cartridges, the stylus is part of the cartridge, which is no longer made, and is stupidly expensive to replace! I have the whole of the 5000 system, and need a cartridge for the turntable, so I'm using my trusty SL-5 in place of the Beogram!

Also avoid any of the modern plastic tat that claims it can turn your vinyl into MP3, or any of the 'retro style' things.

There's certainly plenty of good quality 70's, 80's and surprisingly some 90's hi-fi equipment available for very little if you look around.

Regards,
Lloyd.
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Old 5th Jun 2014, 10:26 pm   #13
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

I would recommend a Technics SL-D303 direct drive turntable. Managed to pick up a couple, one from Cash Converters and the other from a car boot sale. Nice sound and solid build quality, stylus easily available. If you plan to use it with a modern micro system (check Richer Sounds, they usually have a Denon or similar for around £150) as the amplifier you will need a small pre-amp.

Hope this helps,

Kev
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Old 6th Jun 2014, 12:55 pm   #14
Michael Maurice
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

One of the things that let down the Sony system that you have were the speakers. It shouldn't be too difficult to pick up a pair good bookshelf speakers, fit the appropriate connectors, then get the deck serviced
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Old 6th Jun 2014, 2:23 pm   #15
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Default Re: Please help me choose a Record Player!

Michael Maurice has a point. In the early 80's I had a Fidelity UA7 that I found on the local tip. It was in working order complete with it's matching plastic speakers which were quite stylish but sounded absolutely awful! So I bought some speakers from a junk shop for a fiver and while I won't pretend they instantly transformed the Fidelity into a hi fi system, they certainly made a massive improvement to the sound. The UA7 was not a particularly great record player but replacement speakers made it acceptably good.

Regards,
Paul
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