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Vintage Computers Any vintage computer systems, calculators, video games etc., but with an emphasis on 1980s and earlier equipment. |
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9th Mar 2017, 8:14 pm | #1 |
Heptode
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Milton Keynes, Buckinghamshire, UK.
Posts: 931
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Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
First is a disclaimer: this machine isn't being used for real web browsing, or even likely to be making contact with the outside world. It's purely for my own entertainment, and looking at stuff on my local network. Main reason I'd like to get something capable of reading webpages is that quite a few bits of documentation I have are are stored in HTML format.
The machine: circa 1992 Toshiba T5200 portable. 15MHz 386 CPU, 8Mb of memory, running Windows for Workgroups 3.11. Networking is handled by an equally ancient 3Com Etherlink III card, and that side of things is all up and running perfectly. As is the TCP/IP stack, and file sharing - which has made software installation far less of a chore as I don't need to rely on the time consuming faff of writing a thousand floppy discs! Two things I could do with are a web browser and PDF viewer... So what would people suggest I give a try? Again - I'm not planning to surf the actual web on this thing - beyond possibly to take a few screenshots to show why it's really not a good idea! |
9th Mar 2017, 9:19 pm | #2 |
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
The early versions of Internet Explorer are probably your best bet - I think IE5 was the last one to support WFW, though I understand it's pretty grim. You could also try Arachne.
Windows 3 predated the WWW so you shouldn't expect anything to work especially well. |
9th Mar 2017, 9:38 pm | #3 |
Guest
Posts: n/a
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
If it were mine a baby Linux would be my choice, best of luck!
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9th Mar 2017, 10:10 pm | #4 |
Heptode
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Milton Keynes, Buckinghamshire, UK.
Posts: 931
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
I've had a play around with Linux, but so far I've not had any luck getting an X Server running. Biggest issue seems to be memory limitations. So far I've not managed to find anything which will give me anything beyond a command line with only 8 meg of memory to work with.
I *think* I can upgrade it to 16mb - if I can remember where on earth the box with my 32 pin memory was last seen... Plus half the reason I've got this machine set up is as essentially a replica of my first computer, which means Windows 3.1/3.11 and a lot of software from that era. Despite its flaws and limitations, I have a soft spot for Windows 3.*. |
9th Mar 2017, 10:22 pm | #5 |
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
I don't think you will get Linux with a GUI running acceptably on that hardware. WfW is probably your best bet - at least it was designed to run with those constraints.
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9th Mar 2017, 10:37 pm | #6 |
Heptode
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Milton Keynes, Buckinghamshire, UK.
Posts: 931
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Pretty much sums up my findings so far then. Thanks for the pointer for Arachne, that certainly sounds both promising - and genuinely interesting in its own right.
It's astonishing how complete a networking solution is possible on such ancient hardware really...The fact I can browse the shared folders on my network, even print to one of the shared printers and can actually access the internet on a PC from 1992 is quite surprising I think. Toshiba would be pretty proud to see their machines still able to do this much after 25 years with naught but a dead BIOS battery needing sorted and the floppy drive heads having needed a clean. |
9th Mar 2017, 11:46 pm | #7 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Bewdley, Worcestershire, UK.
Posts: 4,748
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
I used to browse the internet and retrieve e-mails quite successfully using a Compaq Aero 33MHz colour sub-notebook running Windows 3.11. I was an AOL subscriber and so I used AOL's own browser, but I vaguely recall also trying a version of Opera. The modem was a 56k PCMCIA device. It worked but it was pretty slow, even then. I can't imagine how it would cope with typical web pages today!
Incidentally, for some time I used a brilliant program called Calmira II which made the classic Windows 3.1 GUI look just like Windows 95. No right-click facility though.
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Phil Optimist [n]: One who is not in possession of the full facts |
10th Mar 2017, 10:55 am | #8 |
Heptode
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Milton Keynes, Buckinghamshire, UK.
Posts: 931
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Think I remember that, similar to Newlook for RiscOS 3.
No interest in changing the UI though, I like the look of Windows 3.1. In fact, have a half constructed GTK theme for my Linux machines based on that appearance I've been trying to find time to finish for years... |
10th Mar 2017, 2:20 pm | #10 |
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Cardiff
Posts: 9,072
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Perhaps look for an early version of Netscape Navigator. That's what many people used (rather than IE) back when this was current spec. It will still be fairly grim though, and a lot of websites probably won't work properly.
For PDF viewing then an older version of Adobe Acrobat Reader should work if you can find one. Version 5 is a good bet, though I can't remember if that works on Windows 3.1 or is for Windows 95 onwards. |
10th Mar 2017, 3:38 pm | #11 |
Guest
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Cor, I remember getting Netscape on a floppy when I started using the internet in the 90's. £15 a month (plus call charges) for dial up, how things have changed.
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10th Mar 2017, 8:37 pm | #12 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Heckmondwike, West Yorkshire, UK.
Posts: 9,642
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Old magazine discs often had browsers on them if anyone kept any.
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11th Mar 2017, 9:15 am | #13 |
Heptode
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Worthing, Sussex, UK.
Posts: 662
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Consider an old version of Opera - it is very light weight. I run it on a Compaq 386 PC with 8MByte of memory, slow but usable!
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11th Mar 2017, 11:34 pm | #14 |
Dekatron
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Invercargill, New Zealand
Posts: 3,458
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
I'd go for an old Internet Explorer - probably 3 or 4, although 5 is supported. Netscape was pretty average on those old machines - I tried it for a bit and went back to IE2, even without frames it seemed faster and more reliable (frames were only supported from IE3).
It's a long time ago though, and I can't really remember what I used with Windows for Workgroups machines at work (I had Windows 95 from the preview/beta stage at home, worked better with the BBS) - I know we used Trumpet Winsock for Southnet's SLIP connection, and Marc Cohen, owner of Southnet, liked Netscape. |
12th Mar 2017, 12:22 am | #15 |
Hexode
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Liverpool, Merseyside, UK.
Posts: 453
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
I used Arachne about 17 years ago to see if I could get an Amstrad 286 to work on the internet. It did work, but wasn't something I would want to use regularly. The issue with regard to this thread is that as far as I am aware it is a complete suite including browser and TCP/IP stack and is designed to run in DOS. I didn't think it would work in Windows 3.1, but it was a long time ago, and in any case my 286 would only run Windows 3.1 in real mode and it wasn't possible to get Trumpet Winsock running on it.
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12th Mar 2017, 12:49 am | #16 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK.
Posts: 1,517
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Computers aren't my line of expertise but, as someone mentioned AOL earlier, I have some early versions on disc if you wish to give that a try. Certainly worked on Win 95 but can't swear to 3.1.
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12th Mar 2017, 1:37 am | #17 |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Windows 3.1 is little more than a DOS task switcher with a GUI grafted on, so I would expect any DOS software to work, though there may be issues with conflicting TCP/IP stacks and I've never used Arachne in that environment (or any other, apart from as a quick experiment).
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12th Mar 2017, 8:26 am | #18 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Bewdley, Worcestershire, UK.
Posts: 4,748
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
From memory, AOL versions 8, 9, 10 and probably later certainly ran well on my Windows 3.11 486. I used AOL for several years from 1995 onwards.
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Phil Optimist [n]: One who is not in possession of the full facts |
12th Mar 2017, 7:51 pm | #19 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Wigan, Greater Manchester, UK.
Posts: 9,433
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
Found this web site, no knowledge whether it is safe. Treat with caution.
http://www.oldapps.com/internet_expl...em=Windows_3.1 |
13th Mar 2017, 9:26 pm | #20 |
Heptode
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Milton Keynes, Buckinghamshire, UK.
Posts: 931
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Re: Best Browser for an ancient PC (Windows 3.11)
It's one I've used before and generally been fine.
The main source I tend to use for legacy software is over here at Winworld which has proved invaluable for me when I discovered that the mould at our old house had eaten several of my sets of discs, not limited to but including Word 2.0c and Excel 4.0. Rediscovered quite a few old applications over there as well that I've got buried in the loft somewhere that I had previously completely forgotten about. |