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Old 1st Apr 2015, 9:50 am   #1
Vinylista
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Default Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

I have my Garrard SP25 MKII working and playing through a Rocksan Kandy amp now I have replaced the DIN plug with a modern Neutrik one as despite several goes with contact cleaner the old one was just too oxidised to function.

I have taken a photo of my final rig to upload to the forum and I am just waiting for it to transfer across from my phone.

However I have one last issue in that the tone arm sticks before the record has played completely, does anyone know what I have to adjust to fix this?

Also my girlfriend has taken one look at my setup and instantly fallen in love with it. She is already keeping an eye online for a unit to bring back to life. She is looking at a Heathkit AD17 online that is running slightly slowly (I am guessing that might be a drive bet issue). Is it worth her picking up the unit and trying to fix it? It is local to us and we could take our time over it.

I have now set up a little workshop in my utility room and we are having endless fun tinkering.

David
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 10:35 am   #2
Audio1950
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

The arm is sticking towards the end of the record because the trip pawl is gummed up with old grease and dirt.
Take the turntable off, and you'll see a large cog adjacent to the centre spindle. Remove the cog, and, carefully noting how it it assembled, remove the attached swivelling bit, which is the trip pawl. Thoroughly clean the various bits with WD40, white spirit, or thinners, also clean the eccentric groove in the underside of the large cog, and the protruding pin that sits in the groove. Reassemble, but don't use any grease or oil on the trip pawl, it relies on friction alone. Put a thin layer of grease in the eccentric groove, and replace the cog. You may have to wiggle it about a bit to get it to sit on it's locating pin. Job done.

Barry
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 11:40 am   #3
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Thanks a million, I will take a look this evening.

In the meantime, a thing of beauty!
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 11:50 am   #4
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Oh and one more question. I undid the turntable screws on the deck and it still appears to be attached by the springs. How to I safely dismount the turntable from its springs?

Thanks,

David
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 12:11 pm   #5
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

I hope those eminently pokeable dome tweeters are well out of reach of the little darlings in the picture.........

There should be some flippable flaps on the bottom of the transit screws which can be poked into an inline position to enable the deck to be removed from the plinth. I believe the springs come away with it, though they may be a tight fit in the counterbores in the plinth top.
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 1:54 pm   #6
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Smile Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Hi,
The deck is designed to 'float' on the springs and it can be removed from the plinth as Herald has said. But you don't need to do that to access the trip pawl. Just remove the circlip from the centre and the turntable will (or should) lift off.
Cheers, Pete.
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 4:51 pm   #7
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Okay guys remember that I can be a bit dumb when it comes to doing practical things, although once I have done something once I am fine.

I have removed the unit from the Goodman housing and looked underneath and I cannot see any of the components being described to me.

I have also taken a look at the platter to see if I can get in that way and I cannot see an obvious spring clip to remove.

I attach two photos to illustrate my confusion...

Any help gratefully received... I am so close to having a lovely system now!

David
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 5:30 pm   #8
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Not 100% sure about this...long time since I've done one, but I think that the rubber mat has lugs on the underside which clip into holes in the turntable. You have to carefully lift off the mat-which is complete with that alloy disk seen in your 2nd pic. Then you'll see the circlip retaining the turntable.
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 5:48 pm   #9
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

If I remember correctly, the alloy disk in the middle comes out of the rubber mat. Be careful, it bends very easily.
Stuart.
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 5:55 pm   #10
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

I am pretty certain that the Mk 2 is the same as the Mk 1 in that viewing the second photograph, the small metal disc in the centre of the rubber mat can be eased out from the rubber by use of either a small screwdriver or cocktail stick. Just ease the rubber back in one place and move the screwdriver or stick down and under the plate. You should then be able to run the impliment round the plate until it pops out exposing the circlip which holds the turntable onto the spindle above the ballrace bearing thereunder. All of what you seek awaits you upon lifting off the turntable! Beware of the upper washer which will probably be attached to the surface of the bottom part of the turntable as you lift it off!

Mike
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 7:00 pm   #11
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Okay, I have done everything that has been suggested, I think...

I got the plinth off, it was cruddy in there, the cog was cruddy, I used GT85. It is now clean. I have tried just replacing the cog and I am not sure it is making a difference. I am concerned that a little metal bit under the tonearm is reaching the end of its designed range of travel. Pictures illustrate...

Also what kind of grease should I use?

David
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Old 1st Apr 2015, 10:07 pm   #12
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Have you removed and cleaned the trip pawl ( the brass bit attached to the cog in pics 3 and 4)? It's vital that it's scrupulously clean and free from oil and grease.

Use any general purpose grease from a car parts outlet or hardware store. I use Halfords general purpose.

I don't understand what "little metal bit" you mean, but can you move the arm by hand to the centre of the turntable? If you can, then there's nothing wrong with it.

Barry
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Old 2nd Apr 2015, 12:35 am   #13
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Okay, I will clean trip pawl in the morning and pop into our local hardware store in tomorrow for grease. (We are fortunate to still have one with a man behind the counter: at least for the remainder of this year).

4 candles!

David
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Old 2nd Apr 2015, 9:35 am   #14
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Thanks for all your help yesterday everybody. I am back at it!

Having survived the good old split right pinging off around the room conundrum this morning, I have continued to clean what I think to be the trip pawl: pictures attached.

My girlfriend is at the hardware store picking me up a tube of grease, but the pawl is lodged in and very stiff. Two questions:

1) Is that right? If not what should I do?
2) What position should it be set in when I reassemble the player?

David
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Old 2nd Apr 2015, 9:51 am   #15
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Grr! Hardware store man claims not to have the right stuff for the job.
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Old 2nd Apr 2015, 10:00 am   #16
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Lithium grease sold in blue tubes in Halfords and B&Q is fine. Sometimes labelled "Car lube".

The trip pawl should be rattly and loose once freed properly freed. They can be stubborn, don't force it too much. Get a hair drier and heat the area for a minute or 2 and start gently prising at it with a screw driver, eventually it will move and come out. Be patient and it will come free. You can then clean the pin of the trip pawl and the part it goes into with some solvent or WD40.

General advice is not to lubricate it at all once clean. I like to use a small drop of very light oil myself
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Old 2nd Apr 2015, 10:31 am   #17
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

So I do need to get it out then? I have a heat gun or my daughter's hair dryer, would the heat gun be too intense?

David
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Old 2nd Apr 2015, 10:37 am   #18
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

I've always used a hair drier to great effect, maybe a heat gun would risk getting it too hot. Soldering irons are also used by some here too.

There are 2 pieces to the pawl, once all the circlips are off the top piece should come off, leaving the bit under the cam, the part with the pin on it stuck in the cam. With heat and gentle persuasion this piece with its attached pin will come out the bottom.

Try not to rotate the bottom piece on the pin when its stuck as you will loosen it. Once freed and cleaned the pin will move freely in the cam and it will feel very loose.

The old grease really does become like glue in this area.
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Old 2nd Apr 2015, 10:39 am   #19
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Unless you reassemble it all egregiously wrongly, the trip pawl ought to right itself after one or two full change cycles. Use a worthless record for the first tests, just in case.
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Old 2nd Apr 2015, 10:43 am   #20
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Default Re: Stuck tone arm and got the bug!

Thanks Psychman, great advice!

The heat gun was fine. I used it on a low setting and a jeweler's screwdriver to get it out. the old grease is like a hard wax!

I will clean it all carefully and decide is fine film of 3 in one is a good idea.

David
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