|
Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players Open-reel tape recorders, cassette recorders, 8-track players etc. |
|
Thread Tools |
26th Jul 2014, 11:43 am | #1 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
BSR record decks and open reel units are well known. Little seems to have been written about their equally well made T145 8-track players.
I've had an unbranded version for several years, kindly donated by a member of this forum. All it needed was a new belt and head clean to get it in working order. This is a 2-wired T143 MR3 model. Recently a Wien 8TD3 clone appeared on Ebay. Nice to have a spare I thought. Described as a non worker it arrived at my location in due course. Significant differences were immediately apparent: a 5-Pin DIN rather than the 2-phono plugs and a 3-core mains lead. It turns out this is a T143 MR2 version. Getting it working was a simple matter, the 5-pin DIN had to be cut off and replaced by phono plugs as my amplifier doesn't accomodate the DIN connector. The motor was lubricated with 3 in 1 oil, a new belt fitted and head clean resulted in another BSR player in good working order! The first set of photos relate to the unbranded T145 MR3 player, except the first which shows both models. Cheers, Brian Last edited by Focus Diode; 26th Jul 2014 at 11:55 am. |
26th Jul 2014, 11:51 am | #2 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Photos of the Wien 8TD3 version (BSR T145 MR2)
|
26th Jul 2014, 4:32 pm | #3 |
Hexode
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Mablethorpe, Lincolnshire, UK.
Posts: 286
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Yep, got one of those, only mine is branded "Kirton Electronics" with a Scunthorpe address and phone number on the back. I wonder if they are still there?
Nice, solid deck with a good size AC motor. Still see plenty of them kicking about. Nearly always one on eBay. I found a label stuck in mine when I looked at it just now, written by me in 2000 saying that the left channel wasn't working so all caps changed as well as trannies in left channel. It lives in the sitting room in the bottom of the cabinet and always provides good service and has done since it was repaired. I have to say, I have no memory of the repair, must be getting old.................... Mark. |
26th Jul 2014, 10:40 pm | #4 |
Nonode
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Warsaw, Poland and Cambridge, UK
Posts: 2,679
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Those BSR 8-track decks were available surplus from Bull or Greenweld or someone in the late 80s. I had one and it worked well, but coming back to it a few years ago the belt had rotted away. I gave it away on this very forum, I think.
Chris
__________________
What's going on in the workshop? http://martin-jones.com/ |
27th Jul 2014, 8:36 am | #5 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
The belts do decompose through age, in the Wien model the belt had "glued" itself to the capstan wheel and had to be peeled off. I found a replacement in a pack of VCR belts.
Mark- do you recall what transistors you used for your repair? Cheers, Brian |
29th Jul 2014, 8:44 pm | #6 |
Hexode
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Mablethorpe, Lincolnshire, UK.
Posts: 286
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Brian,
I've just had a look inside, it's quite difficult to see the circuit board, but I can see a BC171 looking back at me. I can't remember if the other transistor I replaced is the same as I can't see any others. I kept all the components that I replaced in a little back inside the unit and there are two transistors in there, that is how I know I must have changed more than one. If you need me to poke around any further, let me know. Mark, |
3rd Aug 2014, 7:09 pm | #7 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Many thanks Mark, every little bit of info helps.
Cheers, Brian |
14th Aug 2014, 4:09 pm | #8 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
The Wien version has developed an intermittent fault: hissing and spluttering in the R channel. This can happen suddenly or following a track change. It usually doesn't right itself until the case is tapped, thus a dry joint somewhere is likely.
The problem appears to be heat sensitive as on unboxing the player it functions perfectly on making the usual checks! I'll run it for a couple of hours uncased to see if the problem makes an appearance. Incidentally both players have different pre-amplifiers, the unbranded version having a "High Gain" type where the Wien appears to have a standard one. Cheers, Brian |
14th Aug 2014, 6:43 pm | #9 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Managed to get the fault to show up, sensitive to the lead from the tape head to the pre-amp input. There's a couple of short legged 4.7uF capacitors here so I changed them. All seemed well for a good couple of hours with the cover on so I hoped that was that. Unfortunately not as the fault eventually showed itself up again!
Thankfully I should be getting hold of the manual, (many thanks again Geoff for your help), next week so I'll be able to investigate further. Think it could be the transistor(s) in the R channel output. Cheers, Brian |
15th Aug 2014, 11:52 am | #10 |
Nonode
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Herefordshire, UK.
Posts: 2,495
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Just a thought:
Noisy audio I find is often a speciality of Mullard/Philips 'lockfit' packaged transistors (eg the BC147) used in the low powered sections of audio equipment. |
15th Aug 2014, 9:15 pm | #11 |
Hexode
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Mablethorpe, Lincolnshire, UK.
Posts: 286
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
I found the cause on my deck to be the head itself. Don't know why it was intermittant, but a knock on the side would stop it, just like yours. Track changes jarred the head, so they would stop it too. I had a few spare heads from scrap car decks that had seen little use, so swapped. You could try removing the head and giving it a good polish with brasso. Brutal, but it works. Again, no idea why.
Mark. |
17th Aug 2014, 4:30 pm | #12 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Many thanks for the comments Steve and Mark. It's crossed my mind the head could be responsible. Hopefully I'll have the manual early next week so can investigate further and look at the issues you both mentioned. I have a spare head if all else fails.
Cheers, Brian |
19th Aug 2014, 4:03 pm | #13 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Found the spare head and have ordered some BC546B transistors which should hopefully serve as suitable replacements for the BC208 and BC209C types originally fitted. I've swapped over the connections from the head to the amplifier input to find out what exactly is at fault, IE: if the fault persisits in the R channel we'll know it's the head or if transferred to the L channel we'll know it's the pre-amplifier.
So far it's functioned perfectly, typical! Cheers, Brian |
20th Aug 2014, 10:11 am | #14 |
Nonode
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Herefordshire, UK.
Posts: 2,495
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Re: post no. 13.
Are you certain of your logic here? If the fault persists in the same output channel after you have swopped the connections from the head, then the pre-amp is the suspect. |
20th Aug 2014, 6:20 pm | #15 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
A very good point Steve. By swapping over the connections the R output from the head is transferred to the L channel of the amp and vice versa. The fault did show up again from the R output from the head in the L channel.
This to me would suggest the head is faulty after all, but is it? I do agree this is confusing! Cheers, Brian |
24th Aug 2014, 9:45 pm | #16 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Dismantled the unit for head replacement earlier today. Unfortunately what I thought were screw fixings turned out to look as if the head fixing is welded to the type of matt grey metal known to cause trouble in a famous open reel tape recorder. As my replacement head is completely loose I've postponed the operation for the time being. In the meantime I've polished the existing head with Brasso as suggested by Mark and re-soldered the connections in the hope an internal dry joint could be corrected by heat to the terminals.
All looks good so far so fingers crossed. Mark, if you can let us know more about your head changing experiences this would be most welcome. Many thanks to all who have contributed and for the interest in a format many have thought long forgotten! Cheers, Brian |
25th Aug 2014, 8:23 pm | #17 |
Hexode
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Mablethorpe, Lincolnshire, UK.
Posts: 286
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
I've been thinking about this issue a little bit and have to concede that I may have made a mistake. I have two Radiomobile 208 decks which both suffered from the same crackling fault. Both were cured by a head swap. The heads were held in place by a strap around the outside, the same as the car players they were removed from and not welded to anything.
After you mentioned about the head being welded to a plate, I suppose I cannot have changed the head in the BSR deck. I must have been confused between the decks. However, the BSR deck has suffered from the crackling fault before and I must have cured it with some Brasso. I have also been thinking about the fault itself, what causes it and why Brasso cures it. I suspect that it is caused by static build up on the head, but I don't know why polishing stops it. It certainly restores high-end response as well as curing the crackling. 8 tracks certainly not long-forgotten in this house - players and recorders everywhere. Mark. |
26th Aug 2014, 12:32 pm | #18 |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
i have a Pioneer H-R99 8 track recorder which often crackled, after much investigation i found the crackling was due to the right hand track change contact being at about +30v to chassis ground
this led to some current passing from the contact to the head through the graphite backcoating residues on the front side of some well-used tapes, this was also causing some slight pitting and black carbon residues on the head face, luckily out of the magnetic gap area since the track change circuit was based on a SCR and both contacts were floating at rather high voltages to chassis, the only possible fix was to route the track change circuit through a relay driven by a simple 12v supply rail that allowed me to connect the right hand track change contact to the chassis |
26th Aug 2014, 7:57 pm | #19 |
Hexode
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Mablethorpe, Lincolnshire, UK.
Posts: 286
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Interesting, never thought about the track-change contact voltages passing current along the tape like that. Might be worth disconnecting the solenoid supply and seeing if the crackle disappears.
On the two Radiomobile units I have, the full solenoid current was switched by the little bit of foil on the tape. This led to rapid erosion of the foil and sometimes, double track changes. I put a double pole relay in the circuit. Now the foil only switches the relay coil. One relay pole operates the solenoid and the other disconnects the relay coil from the foil contacts and connects it to a capacitor, which is charged via a resistor from the solenoid circuit. The result of all this is that there is a delay before the relay, and hence the solenoid, drops out. By this time the foil is safely past, so double track changes are eliminated. Perfect track changes every time and no foil erosion. Mark. |
27th Aug 2014, 9:04 am | #20 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Borough of Gateshead, UK.
Posts: 1,420
|
Re: Two BSR T145 8-Track Players
Interesting comments there. Regarding the Wien unit there was a loud audible crack/splutter at channel change which I didn't think anything of despite the other BSR player giving a quiet "blip".
Following the head re-solder and cleaning with Brasso not only has this, (so far), cured the original fault condition it's also cured the loud crack on track change as well! Cheers, Brian |