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Components and Circuits For discussions about component types, alternatives and availability, circuit configurations and modifications etc. Discussions here should be of a general nature and not about specific sets. |
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18th Sep 2017, 10:17 pm | #1 |
Rest in Peace
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Mains connectors. Plugs v sockets, gender etc.
Split from this thread:-
https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...d.php?t=139887 As regards the plug/socket bit, the Tornado ejection seat had a similar arrangement for connecting to the aircraft. They got round the terminology by calling it a "plocket"; I never did find out if the mating half was called a "slug"! Cheers, Frank |
19th Sep 2017, 12:10 pm | #2 |
Dekatron
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
ISTR calling them sugs and plockets. The terms male and female plug and male and female receptacle cover the four basic options for connectors. Add in cable or panel mounting and it gets even more messy!
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21st Sep 2017, 1:30 pm | #3 |
Octode
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
Whatever you call these mains connectors, the concept (I think) is fairly obvious. If there is a metal part that can be touched, then it mustn't be connected to the mains supply when the connectors are separated - otherwise someone could get hurt.
Colin. |
21st Sep 2017, 3:01 pm | #4 |
Dekatron
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
The concept is obvious but didn’t stop some wiring up extension leads with a plug at both ends and the socket on the device.
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Frank |
21st Sep 2017, 4:11 pm | #5 |
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
The in-line flex connectors that you can still buy are clearly labelled "CONNECT TO MAINS" on the socket half and "CONNECT TO APPLIANCE" on the plug half, presumably as an anti-numpty measure.
Plug-to-plug leads are sometimes used with generators, despite recommendations against the practice.
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21st Sep 2017, 4:31 pm | #6 |
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
I'm sure you are right Frank-you can't legislate for "daftness" though.
All the various Bulgin types and inversions must have seemed like a good idea at the time but they can be bit counter-intuitive with regard to the general presumption that a plug usually goes into a socket [and not the other way round]. I can't see a safety problem with this kit as the live "socket" mains feed will shroud the "plug" pins when inserted and the pins won't be live otherwise-was that the thinking? The main difficulty might be in finding the right plug [that is really a socket] at the right price-Bulgin bits seem very expensive these days. Unless absolute authenticity was required I'd be inclined to to just hard wire a mains lead in place, leaving the original socket/plug entirely disconnected and safe of course. Dave W |
21st Sep 2017, 5:01 pm | #7 | |
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
Quote:
Is there any source of mains connectors rated at 16A or so with shrouded pins like "safety" type 4mm banana plugs that could be used for this? It's such a convenient way to connect a domestic backup generator AFTER you turn off the incoming supply switch........
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21st Sep 2017, 11:41 pm | #8 |
Dekatron
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
I don't think so; and even if there was, it probably would only get misused, because you touching the pins is not the only or even the worst hazard, even although it be the most obvious. Besides shorting two phases or a phase and neutral (been there, done that, got the scars from the flying molten metal), there's also a risk of backfeeding into the grid -- or any poor unfortunate s*d working on it.
The "proper" way to do it is to have a suitably-rated changeover switch (or two contactors, both electrically and mechanically interlocked to prevent both closing at once) allowing the consumer unit to be supplied from either the meter or a BS4343 plug (which then need only be rated for as much current as the generator can supply, not necessarily a full load). By the way, if powering a gas appliance with electronic ignition (such as a boiler, or a fully-automatic oven) from a generator or inverter, there needs to be a DC leakage path from Neutral to Earth for the flame sense, or else it will just go into "ignition fail" lockout.
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22nd Sep 2017, 8:44 am | #9 |
Heptode
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
the only connector I can think of that would that is protected both sides (both AC outlet and AC inlet) would be the powercon connector as whilst you can still stick something in a powercon connector and get a shock touching it won't.
there are 3 types, 16A, 20A, 32A the 16A being the only one with breaking capacity with the 16/32A only to be disconnected with the supply off/removed. But as has been said doing it properly with a changeover switch is the only properly safe way of doing it. |
22nd Sep 2017, 9:41 am | #10 |
Dekatron
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
I'd agree with the Neutrik Powercon series. They are locking, and only make contact when you rotate them to engage the lock.
The powerCON TRUE1 are the 16A ones that have breaking capacity. The chassis connectors are available in a single unit with both inlet and outlet http://www.neutrik.co.uk/en-uk/power...nectors/nac3px |
22nd Sep 2017, 12:36 pm | #11 |
Dekatron
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Re: Mains connectors. Plugs v sockets, gender etc.
There have been a number of attempts at making plugs and sockets with pins that are sleeved both ways over the years.
I have only got a 2 amp plug for this one to boot. |
22nd Sep 2017, 1:51 pm | #13 |
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Re: Mains connectors. Plugs v sockets, gender etc.
But you can still touch live bits in Andersons- at any rate the bigger ones like the 350A jobbies.
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22nd Sep 2017, 2:57 pm | #14 |
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Re: Mains connectors. Plugs v sockets, gender etc.
Even if a plug-to-plug lead were fitted with shrouded pins so that it is impossible for the person holding the connector to touch a live part, this would not prevent backfeeding -- which is arguably a worse situation, since it might expose persons unknown to a highly counter-intuitive shock hazard.
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22nd Sep 2017, 6:02 pm | #15 | |
Dekatron
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Re: Mains connectors. Plugs v sockets, gender etc.
Quote:
Even if you get away with it and don't kill a line technician, 'backfeed' to the grid could get interesting for your little generator when utility-power's restored and it suddenly finds itself out-of-phase and fighting the grid! I know which one's going to lose. Proper generator-switching systems employ positive interlocks to prevent this sort of nastiness. |
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22nd Sep 2017, 6:10 pm | #16 | |
Dekatron
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Re: Power plug advice? Pics Inside
Quote:
There's something rather fun about seeing an entire aisle of 42U racks dedicated *solely* to AC power distribution! Specially when each rack has its own /24 IP-range and lets you monitor the current-draw and switch each of the 64A 3-phase outlets from your laptop. |
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