Jubilee Telephone and Bell Set.

[Ravenhook]

Please tell me what I have done wrong..again!.
I have a little Jubilee telephone, the telephone wires are connected up ok, but its this flippin' bell set that is giving me trouble as it does not ring and it is going to be what I haven't done right that is at the bottom of it.
I have this long curly wire with six wires...
Blue
White
Red
Green
Orange
Black

On the Bell Set I have terminals....
1
2
3
4
5
6
7

Connected to terminals...
4&5 are the two blue wires from the trembler.
Connected to terminals...
1&2 are two black wires from a 1.8uf capacitor.

I have linked terminals...
5&6&7 together.
I have fitted the resistor to terminals...
3&4.
I have fitted the curly wires to terminals....
1=red
3=blue
4=black
5=orange
6=green
7=white

I have fitted the line wires to terminals...
1=red
3=blue
7=white
green not connected


the phone works fine but no bell ringing.

[AndiiT]

Hi,
See here

Bear in mind that the first set of instructions are for a compact telephone without the associated Bellset.

Regards

Andrew

[Ravenhook]

That is what I followed and am stumped a bit as the bells don't ring.
Thanks.

[Dave Moll]

According to what you describe, the bell is indeed connected, in series with the resistor, between the blue and white leads. As far as I can see, this leaves only four possibilities:

1: ringing voltage is not being presented between the blue and white leads - either blue is not connected via capacitor to red at the socket or the red and white leads are reversed. The latter can be checked by reversing the red and white leads to the bellset.

2: the bell itself is faulty (e.g. open-circuit).

3: the resistor is open circuit.

4: you have a bad connection at one or more bellset terminals.

[AndiiT]

Hi,
Just a thought - does the bell assembly have a "Volume" lever fitted?

Some of them did and at one end of travel the lever silenced the bell by either mechanical means (stopped the clapper travel to hit the gongs) and/or a microswitch - in the latter case the switch, if fitted, may have become open circuit or be incorrectly wired.

Also, are the straps in the phone itself in the correct position(s)?

Regards

Andrew

[Ravenhook]

No volume lever on the Bellset.
Strap on the phone connections are across Terminals 1&2.
Curly Link wire between phone and bellset connections inside the phone are as follows....
Blue=1
Red=4
White=5
Green=7
Orange=8
Black=10
Both phone and bellset are SA4271 and not the bog standard 776.

[AndiiT]

Hi again,
You could try wiring as a two wire device for now as per this n diagram this might prove if there is a fault with the bell motor or the wiring between the phone and bellset.

I noticed when wiring my Jubilee phone up that it is very easy to confuse the numbering on the bellset terminals so that might be worth checking too.

I think that the SA4271 designation didn't make a lot of difference so the connections should still be the same as the 776.

I have a full installation manual for the Jubilee phone so could run a copy of the connections off from there, if you wish, just in case there are any subtle differences.


Andrew

[Ravenhook]

Yes please Andrew, I have a couple of other Bellsets so this afternoon I am going to wire up another one just in case...I have also checked the continuity between the wires on both the curly wire and the line cable, I have had a problem before with a duff BT plug end.
I noticed on the British Telephones conversion instructions that a 4-wire cable connection was used for the 776, I might reconfigure it to that and see if it kicks it into life.
Thanks.
Duncan.

[AndiiT]

Hi, I'll have to sort it out later for you as the manual is in the loft and the landing area is being decorated as I type.

I've noticed on Bobs instructions that there could be some confusion about the telephone terminals too due to the transmitter terminals being marked T1 and T2 as well as two of the phone terminals although this shouldn't be too difficult to spot and would affect transmission and not ringing.

I wouldn't have thought that re-wiring to use four wires instead of six would make a lot of difference as some of the wires in the six wire cord were not used on a direct exchange line anyway as they were there to allow use with a PMBX as far as I can see from the n - diagram.

Andrew

[Ravenhook]

Thanks Andrew, I have found some of the confusion with the bellset connections are that there are seven actual connections but the N-diagramme alludes to Thirteen...I discovered that they include soldered joints..two for the capacitor, two for the capacitor wires and two for the bell motor wires...7+6=13.
There does seem to be a confusion with the colour of the bell motor wires..Black according to the N-diagramme..Blue in the real world.
I am rewiring it from scratch and ignoring the capacitor as the capacitor wires are generally cut in other bellsets.
Will let you know the outcome.
Duncan.

[AndiiT]

Originally Posted by Ravenhook

......There does seem to be a confusion with the colour of the bell motor wires......

I have seen bell motor wires in Black, Orange, Blue and Yellow which may be attributable to individual manufacturers.

The capacitor can be ignored in the bellset as when wired to the current plug and socket system the capacitor in the master socket replaces it.

I'm not certain but with the Compact telephone (standard or Jubilee version) the capacitor in the telephone itself may need to be connected to balance the transmission circuitry.

Regards

Andrew

[Ravenhook]

Success..!
What I did was to bin the capacitor and it's wires thus removing any confusion, I then put one bell motor wire to terminal post no B3 and the other to B6, links to terminal posts B5, B6, B7 and removed all other link straps and fitted the 2.2K resistor to terminal posts B3 and B4.
Then the curly wires...
Red-post B1
Blue-post B3
White-post B7
Black-post B4
Orange-post B5
Green-post B6

The line wire to...
Red-post B1
Blue-post B3
White-post B7
Green-as it is unused I connected it to the empty unused post B2

Hooray, it rings a treat and works very nicely.
Thank you for your much appreciated help...a nice example to my growing and working museum of lovely mechanical phones.
Duncan.

[AndiiT]

Good to hear that you have managed to get it working.

Andrew