Ferguson 3016 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

dsergeant · 17th Aug 2017, 12:17 pm

This record player has a loud hiss much like reported in a previous thread at http://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/s...d.php?p=791242

"I am trying to fix an old "Ferguson 3016 mains transistor" amp belonging to my elder brother. The cartridge was missing, so I put in a magnetic cartridge and turn ON the set. There is sound but very soft and there is some sort of strong hissing sound behind ( sound like a radio tuned to an empty station). When I plug a CD player into the Tape" input, the sound is loud and clear and does not have that hissing sound at all."

Reading that thread there doesn't seem to be a solution for the hiss. I have established it is before the volume control but have not yet established whether it is pickup on the internal cabling or a duff capacitor/resistor/transistor. I have the service sheet off our DVD.

Anybody know the cure or is it just the normal way it works?

Thanks
Dave

Nuvistor · 17th Aug 2017, 12:36 pm

Is a magnetic cartidge suitable for this player? I would have thought a ceramic type with much higher output would be the correct type.
Low input to the amplifer will require you to turn up the volume and make any hiss much more noticeable.

Frank
Edit, from photos on the web it appears to use a Sonatone 9TA ceramic cartidge

Edward Huggins · 17th Aug 2017, 1:45 pm

Does the hiss increase with the volume setting? Is the volume level good or do you have to turn nearly to max to get an adequate volume? These players are quite loud (a good 3 watts) in their own right and have a seperate tweeter that may emphasise hiss.

peter_sol · 17th Aug 2017, 4:13 pm

As has been said you need a ceramic cartridge not a magnetic.
That is why it is quiet.See post 3

dsergeant · 17th Aug 2017, 4:30 pm

Sorry, what I posted above was a quote from the 2015 thread. The comment about the magnetic cartridge is not relevant to mine.... but the comments about hiss are.
I am not sure what cartridge is fitted but I assume it is the original ceramic.

Having just looked further, there is normally plenty of volume with the volume about half way. The hiss is very noticeable in quiet portions of the record. But the volume seems to decrease as the unit warms up (although the hiss stays the same at the same position of the volume control).

It also skips, which probably indicates it needs a new stylus.

Dave

Edward Huggins · 17th Aug 2017, 5:56 pm

The cartridge in this model should be a most excellent Sonotone 9TA in a very nice Garrard 3000 autochanger. The hiss should not be as noticable as you say and the decay of sound suggests possible capacitor problems. I have one and I know just how good these can sound.

paulsherwin · 17th Aug 2017, 6:41 pm

I would guess you have a noisy transistor in the phono preamp somewhere. What are the types used?

dazzlevision · 17th Aug 2017, 6:59 pm

This may use the Mazda / Thorn produced Germanium transistors and I have come across a few that produced a lot of noise (background "hiss"). They usually have a coloured plastic sleeve over the metal can, with Thorn or Mazda printed on it, plus the type number (e.g. AC151).

AC/HL · 17th Aug 2017, 9:04 pm

The first transistor in an NPN silicon type, possibly Fairchild, but the second is an AF156 germanium, similar to the AF127.
http://www.service-data.com/section.php/2614/1/3016

dsergeant · 18th Aug 2017, 5:50 pm

Thanks for the suggestions. I spent a little time this afternoon isolating the stages by removing the various 2uF capacitors. Initially I had replaced VT2 AC156 using a 2N3904 silicon with no change in the noise. However replacing VT3 AC156 which followed the volume control did - it seems I was confused because when the volume control was turned down it shorted the noise through the 2UF C8 capacitor. I have not got rid of the main noise but there remains a sort of popcorn noise which may well be from VT2 - I had refitted the AC156. More work after the weekend, not sure if it is wise to use silicon transistors bu have very few germanium ones in my junk box.

17th Aug 2017, 12:17 pm	#1
dsergeant Octode Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire,UK. Posts: 1,172	Ferguson 3016 This record player has a loud hiss much like reported in a previous thread at http://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/s...d.php?p=791242 "I am trying to fix an old "Ferguson 3016 mains transistor" amp belonging to my elder brother. The cartridge was missing, so I put in a magnetic cartridge and turn ON the set. There is sound but very soft and there is some sort of strong hissing sound behind ( sound like a radio tuned to an empty station). When I plug a CD player into the Tape" input, the sound is loud and clear and does not have that hissing sound at all." Reading that thread there doesn't seem to be a solution for the hiss. I have established it is before the volume control but have not yet established whether it is pickup on the internal cabling or a duff capacitor/resistor/transistor. I have the service sheet off our DVD. Anybody know the cure or is it just the normal way it works? Thanks Dave

17th Aug 2017, 12:36 pm	#2
Nuvistor Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Wigan, Greater Manchester, UK. Posts: 9,433	Re: Ferguson 3016 Is a magnetic cartidge suitable for this player? I would have thought a ceramic type with much higher output would be the correct type. Low input to the amplifer will require you to turn up the volume and make any hiss much more noticeable. Frank Edit, from photos on the web it appears to use a Sonatone 9TA ceramic cartidge

17th Aug 2017, 1:45 pm	#3
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 8,328	Re: Ferguson 3016 Does the hiss increase with the volume setting? Is the volume level good or do you have to turn nearly to max to get an adequate volume? These players are quite loud (a good 3 watts) in their own right and have a seperate tweeter that may emphasise hiss. __________________ Edward.

17th Aug 2017, 4:13 pm	#4
peter_sol Octode Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Welwyn Garden City, Herts. UK. Posts: 1,906	Re: Ferguson 3016 As has been said you need a ceramic cartridge not a magnetic. That is why it is quiet.See post 3

17th Aug 2017, 4:30 pm	#5
dsergeant Octode Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire,UK. Posts: 1,172	Re: Ferguson 3016 Sorry, what I posted above was a quote from the 2015 thread. The comment about the magnetic cartridge is not relevant to mine.... but the comments about hiss are. I am not sure what cartridge is fitted but I assume it is the original ceramic. Having just looked further, there is normally plenty of volume with the volume about half way. The hiss is very noticeable in quiet portions of the record. But the volume seems to decrease as the unit warms up (although the hiss stays the same at the same position of the volume control). It also skips, which probably indicates it needs a new stylus. Dave

17th Aug 2017, 5:56 pm	#6
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 8,328	Re: Ferguson 3016 The cartridge in this model should be a most excellent Sonotone 9TA in a very nice Garrard 3000 autochanger. The hiss should not be as noticable as you say and the decay of sound suggests possible capacitor problems. I have one and I know just how good these can sound. __________________ Edward.

17th Aug 2017, 6:41 pm	#7
paulsherwin Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Oxford, UK Posts: 27,947	Re: Ferguson 3016 I would guess you have a noisy transistor in the phono preamp somewhere. What are the types used?

17th Aug 2017, 6:59 pm	#8
dazzlevision Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Near Swindon, North Wiltshire, UK. Posts: 3,612	Re: Ferguson 3016 This may use the Mazda / Thorn produced Germanium transistors and I have come across a few that produced a lot of noise (background "hiss"). They usually have a coloured plastic sleeve over the metal can, with Thorn or Mazda printed on it, plus the type number (e.g. AC151).

17th Aug 2017, 9:04 pm	#9
AC/HL Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Heckmondwike, West Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 9,642	Re: Ferguson 3016 The first transistor in an NPN silicon type, possibly Fairchild, but the second is an AF156 germanium, similar to the AF127. http://www.service-data.com/section.php/2614/1/3016

18th Aug 2017, 5:50 pm	#10
dsergeant Octode Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire,UK. Posts: 1,172	Re: Ferguson 3016 Thanks for the suggestions. I spent a little time this afternoon isolating the stages by removing the various 2uF capacitors. Initially I had replaced VT2 AC156 using a 2N3904 silicon with no change in the noise. However replacing VT3 AC156 which followed the volume control did - it seems I was confused because when the volume control was turned down it shorted the noise through the 2UF C8 capacitor. I have not got rid of the main noise but there remains a sort of popcorn noise which may well be from VT2 - I had refitted the AC156. More work after the weekend, not sure if it is wise to use silicon transistors bu have very few germanium ones in my junk box.